1971 Firebird Build ("The Other Woman", a.k.a. Project "T.O.W.")

[Che70velle]

Bryan, if your gonna run a GOOD pump, like a Dailey you mentioned, then I'd personally put the tank in the rear of the car. It absolutely does not have to go in the front, as long as you have a nice oil pump involved. And it will move weight to the rear of the car at the same time. Doesn't have to be in the trunk either...there's room under the car. Far more room than what you have under your hood, ESPECIALLY if your going to go custom built through Stefs.
I'm also not sure that restricted push rods is your answer to this, along with a dry sump. Are you running a high volume oil pump? If so, that could be the issue. I'd bet you didn't drill holes in the lifter trays, for oil return either. The holes help keep the oil out of the area under the valve covers.
The dry sump will solve your oiling problems, if the entire oil distribution AND oil return process is done correctly.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Che70velle

Bryan, if your gonna run a GOOD pump, like a Dailey you mentioned, then I'd personally put the tank in the rear of the car. It absolutely does not have to go in the front, as long as you have a nice oil pump involved. And it will move weight to the rear of the car at the same time. Doesn't have to be in the trunk either...there's room under the car. Far more room than what you have under your hood, ESPECIALLY if your going to go custom built through Stefs.
I'm also not sure that restricted push rods is your answer to this, along with a dry sump. Are you running a high volume oil pump? If so, that could be the issue. I'd bet you didn't drill holes in the lifter trays, for oil return either. The holes help keep the oil out of the area under the valve covers.
The dry sump will solve your oiling problems, if the entire oil distribution AND oil return process is done correctly.

This is the reason I suggested a different engine builder.... There are so many great LS motors out running HARD on the track and not having the issues Bryan is/has had.

[ZMAN1969]

Bryan, sweet build, long read! Pg 19 had me drooling over the BBQ pics.
I used to have a Lucerne blue 72 T/A and this thread made me miss that car IIRC it ended up in Austin. I'll look for you at the next Goodguys I like the auto-X events what fun are the cars if we cant drive them hard? There is a builder up in Dallas are named Watt, I haven't used him but a buddy has if you haven't found anyone yet, carry on!

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by Flash68

Slowly.... Step away from the cardboard....

Peterson 2.5 gallon on a LS in that location.

I'd love to see a picture of the firewall without the tank in place. That 2.5G tank is 24" tall. The mockup I made was the 2G tank, and it's 19.5" tall. There's no way I could put that height in that spot. As I type this, it's possible that may be a 7" diameter tank instead of the 6" I'm considering, but that wouldn't work either for me...

Their downbar is also further out than mine, giving more room between the bar and the engine/header.

Sure looks nice though.

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by grendel

Why not run multiple tanks?

You're not the first person to ask me this...

From the people I have spoken to, this doesn't work. You want the oil to have time in the tank to remove the air (via the baffling in the tanks), and a smaller tank allows less time to do that. I also can only run a single pressure stage, I'm not sure how / if I could even plumb 2 tanks.

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by Che70velle

Bryan, if your gonna run a GOOD pump, like a Dailey you mentioned, then I'd personally put the tank in the rear of the car. It absolutely does not have to go in the front, as long as you have a nice oil pump involved. And it will move weight to the rear of the car at the same time. Doesn't have to be in the trunk either...there's room under the car. Far more room than what you have under your hood, ESPECIALLY if your going to go custom built through Stefs.
I'm also not sure that restricted push rods is your answer to this, along with a dry sump. Are you running a high volume oil pump? If so, that could be the issue. I'd bet you didn't drill holes in the lifter trays, for oil return either. The holes help keep the oil out of the area under the valve covers.
The dry sump will solve your oiling problems, if the entire oil distribution AND oil return process is done correctly.

Hi Scott,

I considered the rear mounted tank. That would be a LONG run for hoses, and it would have to be in the trunk on my car. There just isn't any room under the car for anything else. I don't want to give up my trunk space for a 3-4G tank! This isn't a full-on racecar like Flash's BMF.

This engine is a solid roller, and I use a set of link-bar lifters, so there are no trays to catch the oil. The original engine did have them (they were drilled). Pushrods definitely aren't the total solution, but not having restrictions does push more oil to the valve covers. :\

I'm going to talk with the builder to see if there is anything we could do to improve the drainback from the heads. I don't really want to run external lines for that, but maybe we can open up some passages, or at least smooth them a little if they are rough. I need to look through some of the old pictures of these heads before I installed them...

Oh, and I'm running a Melling 10295, the standard volume / high pressure pump.

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

This is the reason I suggested a different engine builder.... There are so many great LS motors out running HARD on the track and not having the issues Bryan is/has had.

I'm more and more convinced that I should have been just fine with my current combination. As you say, there are plenty of C5 and C6 Vettes on the track which don't run a fancy oiling system, pull more G's than I do, and don't have these problems. Granted, COTA is a hard track on a car, a lot of high RPM 3rd gear time when I was there. Still, my combination shouldn't have had a problem...

I'm VERY curious what we're going to find when it is pulled apart...

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by ZMAN1969

Bryan, sweet build, long read! Pg 19 had me drooling over the BBQ pics.
I used to have a Lucerne blue 72 T/A and this thread made me miss that car IIRC it ended up in Austin. I'll look for you at the next Goodguys I like the auto-X events what fun are the cars if we cant drive them hard? There is a builder up in Dallas are named Watt, I haven't used him but a buddy has if you haven't found anyone yet, carry on!

I'm usually there (this past one being the exception) as are several others of us from the forum. Definitely stop by and say Hello in the Fall!

[Che70velle]

Bryan, carefully examine that oil pump, when you do the tear down. Those have been known to have the relief valve/plunger stick open. Not trying to start an oil pump war, just saying that it's happened before. I'm doing a 5.3 build right now for my nephew, and went with the Melling 295, and I checked it inside and out before installation. Hopefully you'll get your engine woes straightened out on the next one...that has to be getting VERY expensive.

[carbuff]

Originally Posted by Che70velle

Bryan, carefully examine that oil pump, when you do the tear down. Those have been known to have the relief valve/plunger stick open. Not trying to start an oil pump war, just saying that it's happened before. I'm doing a 5.3 build right now for my nephew, and went with the Melling 295, and I checked it inside and out before installation. Hopefully you'll get your engine woes straightened out on the next one...that has to be getting VERY expensive.

Good suggestion. I'll have the builder pull it apart and take a look. I'm looking at one of the Schumann pumps as a possible wet-sump alternative. The plunger is replaced with a stainless steel ball to help prevent exactly what you describe.

Doing a full rebuild again this year after the full rebuild last year, then the cam upgrade, definitely wasn't planned for in the budget. :\ But it will get fixed, and I'll be back on the track soon!