More Door Trouble Maker, Nerd Rods 1957,6.0L, Twin Turbo and C4 Corvette Suspension

[rat_rod_russell]

I figured I finally needed to get the Nerd Rods TriFive car posted up. We plan on doing lots of touring and autocross in this little guy and giving lots of rides. Big power on the cheap and lots of tire on the ground. With luck we'll also get to use this car to make some instructional videos for guys looking at their own DIY frame.

Build List

• Nerd Rods TFC4-S3, TriFive C4 Stage 3 Rolling Chassis
  • TFC4-BLK, Nerd Rods Brake Line Kit
  • TFC4-HK, Nerd Rods Handling Kit
    • Includes Rod End Rear 4 Bar
    • Rear Sway Bars Ends
    • Allows for larger tires on the ground and better handling
  • TFC4-LSFS-TT, Nerd Rods LS Fuel System
    • 20+ Gallon Aluminum Tank and mounting hardware
    • Tank modified for STS Twin Turbo configuration
    • Stainless Steel Hard Lines
    • AN Braided Steel Flex Lines
    • AN Fittings
    • Aeromotive Stealth Fuel Pump, 340 LPH
    • Aeromotive Fuel Pressure regulator with boost reference
• LS based LQ4 6.0L Engine
  • STS Turbo Cam
  • 4130 Push Rods
  • Partiot Valve Springs
• T56, Camaro Configuration
  • Stage 3 Spec Clutch
  • Steel 3-4 Shift Fork
  • Brass Shift Pads
  • Built By Koeting Wagon Works in Austin TX
  • Short Throw Shifter
• C4 Corvette Suspension, 1990 HD
  • Dana 44, 4.10 Gears
  • 12" Rotors, Drilled and Slotted
  • Twin Piston Corvette Front Brakes
  • Single Piston Corvette Rear Brakes
  • 2.75 ratio Corvette Rack
  • Corvette C4 ZR1 Sway Bars
  • Powder Coated Suspension, Brakes and Sway Bars
  • QA1 Double Adjustable Shocks and springs (Everyone gets double adjustable shocks when they buy from us. I'll go more into why later)

So this is how she showed up after we traded for her.

[rat_rod_russell]

Stripped off the trim the cut into the paint to see what was under it and its the awesome Rust Defender we were planning on spraying on the car anyway so not just some smoothing out bodywork. So we steam cleaned the bottom and bead linered the bottom.

[rat_rod_russell]

We had a customer asking some questions about his chassis so we tossed our body onto this frame real fast to show him. Now I just need to get onto our frame.





I'll update this page as we get more done and I'll create an index on this first post for everyone else who comes along.

Later
-Russell

[INTMD8]

I'm curious, why run rear mount turbos with all the room in this car?

[rat_rod_russell]

Originally Posted by INTMD8

I'm curious, why run rear mount turbos with all the room in this car?

Weight, Balance, Price

1) Weighs less
You don't end up with the humgunous headers under the hood with the turbos out in-front of it. You don't need mufflers and you just run the OEM cast iron headers.

2) Chassis balance
By getting all that weight that would be the turbos, headers, intercoolers and piping back in between the wheels instead of out in front you you'll reduce the amount of inertial momentum of the car and lower the CG of the car but will help largely with handling.

3) Price
No elaborate custom headers, no high flow mufflers, no real need to spend money on ported heads or really exotic intakes. All the things you would normally need to spend lots of money on to make that kind of power you get to save. HP to Dollar its hard to see any other combination that will put you into the 600-700 HP range for the same money and still give you room to grow later on.

Bang for the buck its what I really like to do. I would even run a 5.3L but I already had the 6.0L from the PT-57 project so I'm running with it.

[INTMD8]

Well you can mount them up front with oem cast manifolds. We have such a setup on a coworkers 57. I would say then you have less overall weight from not having charge piping running from the back of the car and you save weight from no oil scavenge pump.

The weight would be shifted to the rear but a pair of smaller turbos with v-band housings, wastegates, everything comes in at less than 50lbs.

You would save money on mufflers if you don't plan to use them but everything else is a wash. (well, more money on cold side piping with rear mount). Can use stock manifolds with engine bay mounted turbos and both can be used with stock heads and intake manifolds.

If that's what you prefer than by all means do what you like. From a functional standpoint I like close to zero perceptible lag which I've yet to experience with any rear mount setups.

Bed liner undercarriage looks nice btw. Seeing it on more and more cars and it's starting to grow on me.

[rat_rod_russell]

Your Cadillac is awesome by the way! I've got a customers 57 De ville Coupe here that we'll have on the table soon and I've been sending your photos his way for ideas! And the bed liner is nice for cars like this 4 door. I really don't want to put too much work into it since it'll never be worth anything. The ongoing joke around here is that when we want to sell it we'll pull the body off and get more money for the frame by itself.

It looks to me that the Cadillac has a bit more room under the hood compared to a TriFive. I don't have that all scanned into the computer so I can't quote exact number unfortunately.

I've never experienced any noticeable lag VS tire spin with the STS cars I've been in or built so I can't comment there but I would guess that the turbos were not sized right or the exhaust tubing was too big. I drop the exhaust tubing one size to help raise the velocity of the gas to the turbine as well. It also saving money, weight and time on the installation. For the remote turbo systems they offer sealed turbos now so no more oiling pumps or lines so we don't even have to worry about that weight or leaks any longer. 50lbs that far forward and that high makes a huge difference on the roll center and CG of the car. Just imagine that much weigh with that much leverage over your suspensions roll center as you turn into a corner causing pushing on the front suspension.

The return tubing on my PT-57 truck was all aluminum and was less than 15 lbs total when the truck was done after I removed the inter coolers. I removed the inter coolers from that system because all the aluminum tubing made them redundant. I have this picture but I can't find the written weight. You can see its on a scale and its ticking my off that I can't find that number. All this weighted coming out from the front of the car but I want to say it was 20-25 lbs. And that's off the extreme end of the noise from the truck.



When I had the truck on the dyno the dyno registered 72F as native air temp and my IAT sensor at 6 psi was 75F. We had leaks I didn't have time to hunt down and a really really foul spark map that we couldn't correct I found out later what that was. We used hand held Pyrometers all over the system showed only 5F of heat drop across the IC when it was on the dyno so the only air was from the fan right on the IC not even air flow across the chassis that would cool it even further.

If I was running a built motor or hard core racing I would probably run front mount turbos as well.

Later
-Russell

[INTMD8]

Thanks! If you've built/driven other rear mount turbo cars and like them it's all good, just a matter of preference.

I think the Cadillac has a bit more room than the Chevy though the car I was speaking of was a 57 Chevy with LS3 and 2 small turbos. Has stock 5th gen Camaro manifolds in original orientation with up pipes sweeping up and forward into the turbos.

Looking forward to your chassis pics

[rat_rod_russell]

Originally Posted by INTMD8

Thanks! If you've built/driven other rear mount turbo cars and like them it's all good, just a matter of preference.

I think the Cadillac has a bit more room than the Chevy though the car I was speaking of was a 57 Chevy with LS3 and 2 small turbos. Has stock 5th gen Camaro manifolds in original orientation with up pipes sweeping up and forward into the turbos.

Looking forward to your chassis pics

NICE!! Got any photos of that one?



Minion #1 has some awesome body working skills. This was a surprise to me. Body and paint guys have been a thorn in my side ever since I got into the Hot Rod business and to have a good one working for me will make my life much easier in the long run.

Originally I was telling him to go easy since its only a 4 door and tons of body work won't be worth anything in the long run but I started thinking about it and decided what the heck. Go nuts. Make it as nice as you want so we can see what he can really do and so far it amazing!!!! I just wish I could have him for more than 10 hours a week. I mean, LOOK AT THOSE DOOR JAMS!!! Its going to be gorgeous when he's done.

This is the first round of primer on the quarters. I didn't want him blowing time or mud on the stuff under the fin but we decided later that we didn't need a place for water to just sit and fill up.



This is a TFC4-S4, TriFive C4 Stage 4 Rolling Chassis we're working on along with many other project in the shop.



All by hand as well. He has only touched a single power tool the whole time and this is after the second round of primer.






Later
-Russell

[MattO]

Following this. We have a '57 4-door 210 sitting in our garage that we are going to get started on soon. It's funny because I also have a relationship with the guys over at STS turbo.