1987 IROC Camaro Pro-Touring Build

[garage_engineer]

Continuing on with the disassembly process despite the 10deg temps here in Mass! My little garage heater is working overtime to keep my work space bearable.

I have the fuel rails and injectors off the car. I'm thinking these are Ford "blue" injectors from the 5.0L Cobra... can anyone help me to confirm that? If so, they are 24lb injectors and I think these might not be sufficient for my 350 if they are flowing correctly. I got the following from onallcylinders.com:

injector size in lbs./hr. = (Max. HP x "Brake Specific Fuel Consumption") / (number of injectors x duty cycle)
So...
Max HP = 350 (estimated)
BSFC = 0.5 (estimation for a modified, naturally aspirated engine)
# of injectors = 8
Duty Cycle = 0.80 (the amount of time injector is open versus the total time between firing events; .80 is safe for an OE injector)

(350 x 0.5) / (8 x 0.8) = 27.34 lbs./hr<-- Looks like I need bigger injectors... any thoughts?

I'd like to send them out to get rebuilt and flow tested as well... any suggestions on who could do this?





I also managed to remove the transmission crossmember and started working on getting the transmission out from under the car. I tried supporting it with my floor jack and a piece of wood, but definitely did not feel comfortable doing it that way. That T56 is heavy! I ended up heading over to Harbor Freight and grabbing a small scissor lift to use. I don't mind buying tools like this if it makes my life easier and I'm going to use it again in the future.

[DBasher]

Navigator injectors are blue, Cobra are black...must be some kind of hybrid ��

[WSSix]

Your math is correct. They most likely were pushing the injectors harder, meaning a higher duty cycle. Assuming your injectors are 24lb injectors. YOu can safely push injectors to 85 and 90% if necessary. Just depends on what you need, what's available, and what your fuel pressure is.

According to this link https://www.injectorrx.com/bosch-fuel-injectors/ They are 25lb/hr injectors.

They'll work just fine for you. You can always increase the fuel pressure, too. I recommend a dyno tune or at least a dyno session with O2 reading once you get the car together. You may find power but you'll determine if the engine is safe more importantly

[grendel]

In for the build.

Nice to see a Masshole doing something

[garage_engineer]

Originally Posted by WSSix

Your math is correct. They most likely were pushing the injectors harder, meaning a higher duty cycle. Assuming your injectors are 24lb injectors. YOu can safely push injectors to 85 and 90% if necessary. Just depends on what you need, what's available, and what your fuel pressure is.

According to this link https://www.injectorrx.com/bosch-fuel-injectors/ They are 25lb/hr injectors.

They'll work just fine for you. You can always increase the fuel pressure, too. I recommend a dyno tune or at least a dyno session with O2 reading once you get the car together. You may find power but you'll determine if the engine is safe more importantly

Thanks for the tips Trey. I am sending the injectors out to get flow tested before they are rebuilt to make sure they are actually 24lb/hr. If they aren't I'll be on the lookout for a new set. Dyno tune is also definitely in order. Might be tough finding someone around here who can do it though... most shops are LS based and I don't know if anyone has the ability to burn me a custom chip. I'll need to research that for sure.

Originally Posted by grendel

In for the build.

Nice to see a Masshole doing something

Just doing my part... hopefully you are keeping warm up there in NH!

[garage_engineer]

Slow progress in the garage due to the cold weather and a big snow storm last week, but some progress is better than none!

I got my fuel injectors disconnected from the fuel rail and will be sending them out this week. Some of them look pretty nasty so I'll see what the fuel injector shop says on whether it's worth restoring them or just getting new ones:


I took my shifter out of the car and cleaned it and tagged the bolts before putting it on the storage shelf. Looks like a Pro 5.0 (at least the shifter handle is) and I think I may change it out for something with a stiffer feel. I had an MGW in my Corvette and loved the super short, stiff shifts so I may look into one of those for this car.


I also assembled my engine hoist I got from Harbor Freight. It comes in 2 boxes and initially one of the boxes was wrong, but they swapped it out without a fuss and now she's ready for action


I need some help on something here... my car has trouble starting when it sits for a day or 2. It cranks over fine, but takes quite a while to catch. Once it starts it runs fine, and it'll start right up if I ask it to again on that same day. I think what may be happening is my fuel pressure regulator is slowly bleeding off fuel pressure when the car is off... so when I hit the key the next day, it needs to build up that pressure again before it starts. Does this sounds correct? If so, is there a way I can test my fuel pressure regulator?


Looking like some warmer weather coming this week (we might get above freezing!) so hopefully I'll be able to make some good progress!

[garage_engineer]

We finally got a break in the weather up here in Boston this weekend and I took full advantage and got a lot done in the garage. I'd been working hard to get the engine and transmission ready to remove from the car and I was finally able to get them out this weekend. I'm lucky to have my Dad living nearby and he came over for the day to lend a hand.

I had never pulled an engine, so this was a new process for me. I spent a lot of time researching how to position the crane, how to attach the crane to the engine and so on. I had bought a load leveler but wasn't able to get it hooked up to the thread holes in the back of the engine. Here is the setup I ended up using:


My crane was a bit short to reach the center of the engine from the front. Looking back, I could have maybe made this work, but I ended up going from the side instead.


Final setup:


Before we pulled the engine, I wanted to pull the transmission from under the car. I attached my scissor lift and was able to get to 7 of the 8 bolts holding the transmission to the bellhousing. For the 8th one at the top, I loosened the engine mounts and lowered my scissor lift, essentially angling the transmission down so I could get at it. Once that was done, I disconnected the clutch fork and out she came!


Next we started on the engine. I had left quite a few pieces on the engine thinking I could remove it with them still attached, like the headers and the bellhousing. Our biggest issue was that we couldn't get our hook on the crane perfectly centered, so the driver's side of the engine was rising much faster than the passenger's side. This caused the passenger's side header to keep getting caught on the frame:


So, off it must come. I was TERRIFIED to remove the headers in the car because of the horror stories I've heard about breaking of bolts in the head and the difficulty of getting to some of the bolt heads. Luckily though all of them moved freely. I had to get creative with a couple of them and ran out to grab some stubby wrenches but eventually we got it out.

I got lucky here:


After getting passed that snag, we just took our time and slowly inched the engine up and forward until it was clear of anything holding it back. I was nervous as it was hanging 5ft in the air over my fender but it all worked out OK. Here are some more pictures:

Slowly creeping upwards:


I was terrified at this moment:


My Dad and I:


Safely out of the car:


We finised the day with the engine on it's stand and the transmission on a table ready to be gone through. I was super happy to get this done so smoothly, I now feel like a real car guy since I can say I've pulled an engine! Now the fun can start!

[WSSix]

Congrats! I always hate moving the engine into place as well. Don't sweat lifting the engine from the side. That's how it's done on cars with long front ends. It's how I always do my car and C3 corvettes.

[mitch_04]

Fuel pressure regulators will often bleed fuel, but they are easy to check. You just pull the vacuum line off and if there is fuel inside the vacuum line or dripping out the regulator, it is bad.

You could also have a fuel injector dripping, or the fuel pump could be allowing pressure to bleed back into the tank. All very common.

If you have a way, you can hook a fuel pressure gauge on the rail, then install a shut off valve between rail and pump. Turn the key on until you have built fuel pressure, then shut the valve off. Come back the next morning and see if your rail still has pressure. If it does, you know its the fuel pump. If it doesn't, then it's an injector, or the regulator (just leave the vacuum hose off and see if there is a puddle near it).

[garage_engineer]

Originally Posted by WSSix

Congrats! I always hate moving the engine into place as well. Don't sweat lifting the engine from the side. That's how it's done on cars with long front ends. It's how I always do my car and C3 corvettes.

Thanks Trey!

Originally Posted by mitch_04

Fuel pressure regulators will often bleed fuel, but they are easy to check. You just pull the vacuum line off and if there is fuel inside the vacuum line or dripping out the regulator, it is bad.

You could also have a fuel injector dripping, or the fuel pump could be allowing pressure to bleed back into the tank. All very common.

If you have a way, you can hook a fuel pressure gauge on the rail, then install a shut off valve between rail and pump. Turn the key on until you have built fuel pressure, then shut the valve off. Come back the next morning and see if your rail still has pressure. If it does, you know its the fuel pump. If it doesn't, then it's an injector, or the regulator (just leave the vacuum hose off and see if there is a puddle near it).

Definitely will try this, doesn't seem too hard. That was one of teh annoying little problems that wasn't a huge deal but bugged me alot. Appreciate the tip.