Ok Builders, I need some input... (pics)

[SVPJason]

Originally Posted by ccracin

Jason / Paul,

First, I mean no disrespect at all and I agree there is a right way and the fast way. In my first post I was just trying to say there should be some target and preferably in writing. It looks like you have been doing this for awhile, therefore I still believe you should be able to put some legitimate estimates to this work no matter how bad the car gets. Progress meetings can take care of that and it sounds like you do that. I'm just saying formalize it. Just saying you never know what you get into so I won't give an estimate is a cop out in my opinion. From the pictures, you have been around the block and should have an idea of what it takes to fix everything you have encountered. I estimate the cost of building 1 off million dollar pieces of equipment on a regular basis. If I told my customers this hasn't been done before so I can't put a number on it, I would never get an order. That's just not how business is done and saying you can't put a price or time limit on art is just a bad TV cliche. In the end I am not trying to argue, I'm just trying give another point of view. I certainly can understand the customer being anxious. You are building one bad a$$ ride for him and hopefully he won't push it and cost the overall project. I think my point is made and I don't want continue beating this nag.

On a side note, where in Birmingham are you guys? I graduated from Pelham High School. I lived in the B'ham area for 3 years as a transplant because of my Dad's job. I loved it. Maybe I'll get back there someday.

Later,

No offence taken, that's why I said positive or negative input. I understand where your coming from...

thanks

We're about 30 mile east of B'ham off of I20..

Last question....can you give me the info on those exhaust tips? I'm "in the market" and like those.....

actually they are magnaflow...

[skatinjay27]

yea in one of the pics you can faintly see the magnaflow lable etched on them.

[tjbruning]

Originally Posted by skatinjay27

yea in one of the pics you can faintly see the magnaflow lable etched on them.

to totally derail this thread...

[SVPJason]

you have hijacked this this thread and you must die... bwuuuhahahahaha...

[chicane]

Wow... I have to giggle on this one a little.

I mean... eighteen months ago you were delivered a well disguised bag of sh*t. In that eighteen months... you basically did a "Frame off" restoration, to the likes that no one has seen before and would never try to begin with... and then I hear that the game plan has changed whilst in route to it's end game ?? Oh... and don't tell me... you are also running a business and he isn't your only customer ??

And... somehow, this is your fault ??


That's comedy. You should tell him that he's lucky it has only been eighteen months with a two man crew. Especially considering what it is that you have actually accomplished.

Tell him he should check out Lateral-G.net, Pro-Touring.com and introduce himself... and then suggest that he educate himself to the logic and common sense involved with a project of this magnitude. And...

We'll take care of the rest.


Seriously. You need to make him aware that if this requires you to push some other work aside to meet his deadline of SEMA 2009... that you will need to adjust the rate at which you charge to do said work. Personally, I would adopt my theory for correcting the scale...

For example:

Normal rate: $75 an hour

You want it tomorrow: $100

You want it today: $150 an hour

You want it when !?!! : $!?!! an hour


If a client wants exclusivity... the client will have to pay the exclusivity tax.

BTW... nice work. The late model tunnel idea gets props. Kudos

[ironworks]

Originally Posted by chicane

Wow... I have to giggle on this one a little.

I mean... eighteen months ago you were delivered a well disguised bag of sh*t. In that eighteen months... you basically did a "Frame off" restoration, to the likes that no one has seen before and would never try to begin with... and then I hear that the game plan has changed whilst in route to it's end game ?? Oh... and don't tell me... you are also running a business and he isn't your only customer ??

And... somehow, this is your fault ??


That's comedy. You should tell him that he's lucky it has only been eighteen months with a two man crew. Especially considering what it is that you have actually accomplished.

Tell him he should check out Lateral-G.net, Pro-Touring.com and introduce himself... and then suggest that he educate himself to the logic and common sense involved with a project of this magnitude. And...

We'll take care of the rest.


Seriously. You need to make him aware that if this requires you to push some other work aside to meet his deadline of SEMA 2009... that you will need to adjust the rate at which you charge to do said work. Personally, I would adopt my theory for correcting the scale...

For example:

Normal rate: $75 an hour

You want it tomorrow: $100

You want it today: $150 an hour

You want it when !?!! : $!?!! an hour


If a client wants exclusivity... the client will have to pay the exclusivity tax.

BTW... nice work. The late model tunnel idea gets props. Kudos

Very Well said, sounds like a deal to me....

[svp]

Originally Posted by DRJDVM's '69

WOW.... you have alot of work in that car. In my opinion 18 months isnt that bad for the work into that car.....but 18 months is a long time.

Question...did it take that long because of your end alone? In other words, were there any big breaks due to waiting on the customer or parts etc ?

There was some time waiting for parts for example once we got down to what was left and put together the parts list there was a short wait for the truckload of sheetmetal. However there were other cars in the shop ahead of him in line so there were times when the other jobs had a priority and he understood that going in. In the end I know he is excited about the car and that is the reason for him "pushing" on it.

There was nearly a 2 month search to find a donor for the rear drain channel specific to the convertible...it is not reproduced and the labor to duplicate it would have been extensive....once we located a donor we were back to work again.

Question #2....is this car some very valuable model etc ? If I had that car and saw the carnage, I would have stopped and gotten a different car....unless its some rare car...in which case, you would have been better off going "original". Thats a pretty thrashed car to start with and unless the customer was dead set on using that exact car, it would have been much better to start all over on a better starter car.

No, it is a standard C code 289 2V pond scum green convertible...factory A/C, deluxe interior....the base car was a run of the mill car. He searched and searched to find a solid car and this one was represented as such. The problem is that a lot of this was really well hidden by a previous owner...the fenders and quarters were rust free...the quarters were even Ford replacements so it appeared good. The seller even placed those thin refrigerator magnets on the panels to show him it was metal. Once we got into the car though it was past the point of being able to just put the car back together and sell it....it was a loss at that point so what do you do? He just decided to push forward....we would have been at the same level buying a $400 piece of junk but once the car was torn down, blasted and the mess discovered it was past the point of no return so the initial investment in the car was a loss. Some of the parts that were useable and not needed were sold off but that was not much of a dent in the overall purchase. The seller of the car was a Mopar guy in South Texas who took the car in on trade so he didn't know the history of the car.

I have another customer with a '69 Fastback that also got taken but his was more mechanical shortcomings than body but the initial investment was similar. I always suggest someone bring a car to us for inspection before buying....not easy with this car being in Texas and I did look at the pictures and gave him my impression based on the information put in front of me. The guy with the 69 is local...the finance company told him they required an inspection so he didn't bring it to us....he should have because he bought a $5K car for $15K but that's another story.

Last question....can you give me the info on those exhaust tips? I'm "in the market" and like those.....

The exhaust tips are Magnaflow: http://www.magnaflow.com/02product/s...e=main&id=8221

They are too wide for the stock valance opening on the Mustang, we had to widen the opening for them to fit.

[J2SpeedandCustom]

Nice work!

Just out of curiosity what was or is the customers budget? What were/are his expectations for the car?

From my experience customers have "scope" creep, which means they continually think about new or different things to do. The problem with that is what you are facing right now he doesn't understand what those changes mean in time and money. Communication is key and it sounds like you both aren't on the same page. Remember it's "his" car so getting on the same page, with the same goal is paramount. Building a car is all about comprimises if he wants it done for a show, then a path needs to be laid out for him to get to that goal. He will realize once shown what the car will look like going down that path. And he may be alright with that...

[tellyv]

I'd get paid up to date and tell him to take the car elsewhere. He'll probably screw you over in the end.

[ccracin]

Originally Posted by J2SpeedandCustom

From my experience customers have "scope" creep, which means they continually think about new or different things to do. The problem with that is what you are facing right now he doesn't understand what those changes mean in time and money. Communication is key and it sounds like you both aren't on the same page. Remember it's "his" car so getting on the same page, with the same goal is paramount. Building a car is all about comprimises if he wants it done for a show, then a path needs to be laid out for him to get to that goal. He will realize once shown what the car will look like going down that path. And he may be alright with that...