Somebody FREAKIN shoot me!!!!

[ironworks]

Originally Posted by Mkelcy

There are many issues in the air here.

On education: do some reading on the Finnish educational system - they don't test; they surely don't use standardized tests; teachers are highly paid and even more respected; they view investment in their kids as critically important; oh, and they are also one of the most successful public school systems in the world. Note that none of those statements are (generally speaking) true of our educational system.

Next, the notion that the 1% are the economy is just utter BS. The vast majority of the 1% are executives who have played the corporate political game well, Wall Street vulture capitalists of various stripes who have manipulated financial instruments of various kinds (including corporate LBO's, junk bonds and so on), folks with inherited wealth and so on. The folks making $1,000,000 or more per year aren't, so far as I can, see job creators: they are the lucky beneficiaries of the visionaries who were, in fact, the job creators or are manipulating the legacies of those same job creators. Mostly the 1% are corporate executives (aka job exporters) and financial manipulators who have never created anything.

The "job creators" are folks like my gardener who has 2 employees on his payroll, the guy who painted my house recently, and all the other small shops and businesses throughout this country. With each job they create, their employees can afford to consume more goods, the fortune 500 companies run by the 1% get to sell more stuff and claim to be "job creators."

What this thread does demonstrate is that, as a nation, our values are seriously out of whack.

So who house is the gardener gardening? If he needs help it must be a big house. Same for the painter.
I can tell you that guy living on welfare does not have a gardener, his landlord does who probably owns a few properties.

I work with 1%ers everyday who create jobs in my shop on a daily basis. I would be glad to hire 2 more if the system provided something for the guys who choose something for their lives besides college.

[bdahlg68]

Originally Posted by ironworks

So who house is the gardener gardening? If he needs help it must be a big house. Same for the painter.
I can tell you that guy living on welfare does not have a gardener, his landlord does who probably owns a few properties.

I work with 1%ers everyday who create jobs in my shop on a daily basis. I would be glad to hire 2 more if the system provided something for the guys who choose something for their lives besides college.

Normally your posts make me think 2 things. Either I'm thinking, "Man, this guy is an eh-hole!" Or, I'm thinking, "damn, that's some sweet fabricatio!n". How dare you post something that makes me think you might have a clue outside the shop!

[ironworks]

Originally Posted by bdahlg68

Normally your posts make me think 2 things. Either I'm thinking, "Man, this guy is an eh-hole!" Or, I'm thinking, "damn, that's some sweet fabricatio!n". How dare you post something that makes me think you might have a clue outside the shop!

Both thoughts seem totally logical.

But to think somebody with minimal cash is going to outspend some guy with money is illogical.

Just think of the people the 1%ers in my shop employ, well my 8 employees, the welding supply and repair store, the garbage man, my landlord, power company, all my parts suppliers, the drivers who deliver parts,the scrap metal guys who pick up the scrap, my laser cutter and machinists, plus all garderers who work for everyone listed above, and the painters.

You could carry that even further to the people we spend our profits from the 1%ers on, race car parts for my hobby stock, all the way down to the rawhide bones my widest dog consumes at a ridiculous pace. Somebody had to make that thing for the dog to chew. To the guy building my swimming pool to the guy I buy my gasoline from.

[Fluid Power]

Originally Posted by ironworks

Both thoughts seem totally logical.

But to think somebody with minimal cash is going to outspend some guy with money is illogical.

Just think of the people the 1%ers in my shop employ, well my 8 employees, the welding supply and repair store, the garbage man, my landlord, power company, all my parts suppliers, the drivers who deliver parts,the scrap metal guys who pick up the scrap, my laser cutter and machinists, plus all garderers who work for everyone listed above, and the painters.

You could carry that even further to the people we spend our profits from the 1%ers on, race car parts for my hobby stock, all the way down to the rawhide bones my widest dog consumes at a ridiculous pace. Somebody had to make that thing for the dog to chew. To the guy building my swimming pool to the guy I buy my gasoline from.

Agreed. I own my own business. I have 5 employees and own my building with a tenant. I pay the yard guy, the landscaper in the spring and fall, the trash guy, the propane company, etc. etc. I am doing a nice project for PPG right now, the CEO of PPG is a 1%er, and PPG is adding a monster production line at a local finishing plant. The number of work (albeit temp) is huge. This construction guys, the electricians, the mechanical contractors, Me! all allows us to make money and put it back into the local economy. Corporations ARE job creators. As are the 1%ers. Another case in point: My best friend is SUPER wealthy. Huge house in a super affluent neighbor hood, a house in Naples, FLA on the water and a gentleman's farm here in town. The money is old family money. He owns a steel erection business and has grown the thing like mad, adding people and buying equipment like crazy. He could have sat around and sucked the tit of family wealth, but this guy will out work darn near anyone. And by work I mean drive equipment and walk the iron. He looks like he doesn't have 2 nickels to rub together. He might be the exception, but all of his neighbors are mostly guys just like himself, concrete company owners, commercial construction guys etc...

Darren

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by ironworks

Both thoughts seem totally logical.

But to think somebody with minimal cash is going to outspend some guy with money is illogical.

Just think of the people the 1%ers in my shop employ, well my 8 employees, the welding supply and repair store, the garbage man, my landlord, power company, all my parts suppliers, the drivers who deliver parts,the scrap metal guys who pick up the scrap, my laser cutter and machinists, plus all garderers who work for everyone listed above, and the painters.

You could carry that even further to the people we spend our profits from the 1%ers on, race car parts for my hobby stock, all the way down to the rawhide bones my widest dog consumes at a ridiculous pace. Somebody had to make that thing for the dog to chew. To the guy building my swimming pool to the guy I buy my gasoline from.

This is why I said the Mkelcy doesn't understand who really creates jobs - which in turn creates taxes...

Obviously the 1% is not the driving force for the economy - it's probably more like the top 30%.... The point is - it's not the bottom 50%. My MONTHLY budget is about what most GROSS per year. And it employs an awful lot of people. That's not bragging - it's just a fact. So think about that -- I'm equal to about 12 people in spending. The difference is I'm not just buying basic services and groceries etc.

I just don't think some folks realize where their income comes from. And when I hear this constant attack on "wealth" I know that it's from someone that has no understanding of an economy.

BTW --- YOUR GARDNER DID NOT CREATE THE JOB --- The guy that employs your gardner did. A gardner with no employer doesn't create anything.

What I dislike the MOST about the current POTUS is his constant class warfare attitude. He is SUPPOSED to be the POT UNITED States... not the "we against them" people.

I would also invite folks to actually look up who pays the "lions share" of all the taxes collected by the IRS. It might surprise those that think the top earners aren't doing their share. I beg to differ. But that's not really an argument. All the polls that I've read have said that the 1% don't mind paying higher taxes. What they do care about is the growth of the US budget and what's behind that growth. And that they want to see more constraint.