Thinking of jumping in but...

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

You're so far off it's not funny. I'm not trying to be mean or belittle your dream or desires. You asked for fair and honest opinions and that's what you're getting on here. Nobody is flaming you or the car... we're just "experienced" and know what the heck happens and what things cost and probably understand your expectations even better than you do.

Please just enjoy reading about the builds here and live vicariously. When you do have extra money --- Read "Investing 102" https://lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=34700 on Lateral-G and then when you're near retirement - you'll be a millionaire and can afford to do one of these dream cars for yourself.

BEFORE you buy the car ---- ask the seller if he'd be willing to go with you and drive it to a couple shops in your area and discuss what you are thinking about and your budget and time frame. PLEASE DO THIS BEFORE BUYING.... it will really open your eyes.

No offense taken whatsoever, I absolutely value your opinion and I'm all ears to your experience. Really thank you! You've broken the process down exceptionally well and scaring the crap out of me. In fact, I think what you've stated should be a sticky.
You mentioned investing 102, I'll be sure to read it.
I'm already looking into getting autobody/mechanical estimates from local shops. Found some that'll do it for free, but from your wise words I now find them all suspicious. I'll do the checks as you mentioned.

Originally Posted by FETorino

The fact that you think the engine and misc will be less than the interior shows you are walking into a wall.

Project managing a complete restoration with no real knowledge is a recipe for disaster. I see you trying to talk yourself and all of us into paying to much for that 71 but if you do you will regret it.

Yeah, I'm starting to feel that "wall" headache creeping in. Awesome list of items I can use to grind him down if I go that way. Thank you.
You're right, I do seem to be talking myself into it. But there's a long story attached to why I have such a strong desire for a 71 Bird, but I won't go there.

Originally Posted by Vince@MSperfab

Beware of clean white cars. Make sure you have it inspected by a pro. Spend a few bucks.
I still like the Silver car better. But im a glutton for punishment.

Can't put my finger on it but yes, the Silver one just appeals so much more to me.


Thank you all for your wise advice, please keep it coming. It's all incredibly logical and intelligent and I hope to take it vs...listening to the little head if you get my drift.

[Sieg]

Originally Posted by BBBluey

Thank you all for your wise advice, please keep it coming. It's all incredibly logical and intelligent and I hope to take it vs...listening to the little head if you get my drift.

All three of these guys are seasoned, experienced, realistic, honest, and just good all-around individuals. (Some more seasoned than others )

Bottom line - You can trust the advice and they aren't inflating or overstating reality considering the lack of information available to them.

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by Sieg

All three of these guys are seasoned, experienced, realistic, honest, and just good all-around individuals. (Some more seasoned than others )

Bottom line - You can trust the advice and they aren't inflating or overstating reality considering the lack of information available to them.

I do feel in good hands but... well, no excuses, sometimes we just do what we do. But I must say you all rock! There's no doubt about the incite and experience.

As far as more info goes, here's a link to pics he provided:
http://s692.photobucket.com/user/197...ula%20Firebird

[GregWeld]

The interior of the SD Formula is absolutely hammered....


Seat Covers -- which is DYI -- 289 per seat for the fronts

Seat FOAM -- DYI -- 132 per seat

So before you do ANYTHING else to the car -- you've got almost a grand in the two front seats.... that's 10% of your total budget... and we haven't replaced the door panels - or the rear seat or the carpet.... So 20% or so of your budget is getting the interior to fair condition. That's seats, front and rear - and door panels...

Now -- ALL the wubba (rubber) in that car is completely shot... so that's a must do item if you want to drive it. There's two pieces -- door seal -- and upper seal -- the door seals are 229 for a pair - but the uppers are 140 EACH - so you've got almost $600 for the door seals and misc crap plus shipping etc...

You haven't got the trunk done yet - and the seller was either afraid to take the crap out of the trunk - or he's just lazy -- or both -- which would explain the condition of the car that he's owned since '07..... but you need a trunk weatherstrip.... and that's another $180

Power window doesn't operate.... so it could be the switch or the motor - or the regulator ---- but it needs to go up and down and you've got the door panel off to replace it so might as well work on getting it running... figure worst case and you need a motor... new ones for both doors with motors $300

Mind you --- this is YOU doing all the work.... so you need to do upholstery and now do windows.... so you're going to need tools and some knowledge... or double the above prices for installation. So figure 40% of your 10,000 budget for interior and weatherstrip - and windows working. $4K ..... not a bad figure if you can find someone to do it for that.

Leaves you 6K for running and dependability.... Lets say the motor just needs a tune up and oil and filters --- and maybe a carburetor rebuild... so that's going to be $750

Change filter and oil in tranny --- $150

Change rear end grease -- $50

Bushings and ball joints to make it be able to go down the highway..... and alignment -- $1250

Shocks -- which have to be shot given the rest of the cars condition... just slap on some Monroe's -- $250

Brakes checked and operable - can't skip that part -- assume you'll need some parts or rotors turned - the fluid MUST be completely changed out etc -- $750

Tires are shot -- I don't give a damn about what the tread looks like -- this thing has ROTTED tires and they MUST be changed... $500

So roughly half your balance is spoken for.....


That leaves you maybe $2500 for stuff that nobody knew it needed.... like if the steering box is shot --- or the tie rods are toasted... or the tranny is puked or the motor is puking blue smoke after driving it 100 miles...

Doable.... yeah -- if you're lucky and find a good mechanic that is honest and is willing to work on the beater.

That's all stuff that MUST be done ----- and you haven't touched the exterior looks. Maaco might paint it silver again... so maybe you have enough for a quick spray job.

All in all said --- you have the cost of the car -- and 10K invested.... and you better pray to god it needs nothing else.

[cluxford]

Here's one done ready to go in the range you are talking of building a project (i.e. listed for $17,500, but could most likely get for a tad less)

no waiting, no working, get in and drive

http://www.haggleme.com/Vehicle/loca...ebird-400.aspx

[GregWeld]

Or this girlie version -- with 54K original miles....


Get out the black vinyl dye and have it black top and black interior in a matter of one weekend....


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-Fire...US_Cars_Trucks

[GregWeld]

21K asking price...


Apparently these are not high priced desirable collector versions. LOL


http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/...e1404603765520

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by cluxford

Here's one done ready to go in the range you are talking of building a project (i.e. listed for $17,500, but could most likely get for a tad less)

no waiting, no working, get in and drive

http://www.haggleme.com/Vehicle/loca...ebird-400.aspx

I actually called that guy a few months ago. He's listed in Houston CL. He said he'd work the price a bit but I didn't get a good vibe from him so I stayed away. He does have the motor modified with a large cam as well, for some reason I still remember that.

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Or this girlie version -- with 54K original miles....
Get out the black vinyl dye and have it black top and black interior in a matter of one weekend....
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pontiac-Fire...US_Cars_Trucks

I do like this girly one but it's way the hell out in PA, so checking it out.... The guy is asking 21K so let's say he goes 17, plus shipping + interior+top =2K, and still unsure of condition, it hasn't been restored only armor all'd.

Originally Posted by GregWeld

21K asking price...
Apparently these are not high priced desirable collector versions. LOL
http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/...e1404603765520

Both of those cars eat my budget just in purchase and I'm still uncertain about their underlying condition. Neither has been restored/rebuilt, just kept clean. The Afro version even states great for a garage queen. I intend to drive the car so I'm certain it'll need repairs as well. It also needs paint and interior (it's original so you know the stitching is going to give).
With the Silver Bird, I'll know what I have as I repair.

I don't think a collector would pay those starting prices knowing they're going to take the car apart anyways in a complete restoration. Although, when I look at the project "trans am with a twist", I can't believe how nice the starting point of that car was, so never mind, I obviously don't know what the hell I'm talking about.

[BBBluey]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

The interior of the SD Formula is absolutely hammered....
Seat Covers -- which is DYI -- 289 per seat for the fronts
Seat FOAM -- DYI -- 132 per seat
and we haven't replaced the door panels - or the rear seat or the carpet....

Now -- ALL the wubba (rubber) in that car is completely shot...There's two pieces -- door seal -- and upper seal -- the door seals are 229 for a pair - but the uppers are 140 EACH - so you've got almost $600 for the door seals and misc crap plus shipping etc... but you need a trunk weatherstrip.... and that's another $180

Leaves you 6K for running and dependability.... Lets say the motor just needs a tune up and oil and filters --- and maybe a carburetor rebuild... so that's going to be $750
Change filter and oil in tranny --- $150
Change rear end grease -- $50
Bushings and ball joints to make it be able to go down the highway..... and alignment -- $1250
Shocks -- which have to be shot given the rest of the cars condition... just slap on some Monroe's -- $250
Brakes checked and operable -- assume you'll need some parts or rotors turned - the fluid MUST be completely changed out etc -- $750

That leaves you maybe $2500 for stuff that nobody knew it needed.... like if the steering box is shot --- or the tie rods are toasted... or the tranny is puked or the motor is puking blue smoke after driving it 100 miles...

Doable.... yeah -- if you're lucky and find a good mechanic that is honest and is willing to work on the beater.

That's all stuff that MUST be done ----- and you haven't touched the exterior looks. Maaco might paint it silver again... so maybe you have enough for a quick spray job.

All in all said --- you have the cost of the car -- and 10K invested.... and you better pray to god it needs nothing else.

Greg, this is an Awesome breakdown and really helps me itemize/piece the required work involved plus cost. I'm writing all of these things down and believe it or not, even discussing it with my CinC (want to make sure I have her support). Really, Thank you. I actually think I can do some of those repairs myself. From the total invested this way, I would choose this over the other two ebay ones.
I think I'm starting to set my own top dollar of what I'm willing to pay for the Bird and/or walk.