David I am not trying to say you’re wrong in any respect... You make some real valid points and I am enjoying this discussion.
Red Flag is an advanced aerial combat training exercise hosted by the U.S. Air Force at Nellis AFB Nevada (Las Vegas). At no point did I say or am i saying the Mustang is the BEST. Most Successful? I think a few F4U Corsair guys from the Pacific might differ on that opinion as they enjoyed a 11:1 kill ratio over the Japanese. LOL
Again not an apples to apples comparison, but the ability of the pilots and experience level is a HUGE factor.
Please don't take this wrong, I am just making a friendly discussion, not trying to say any one opinion is wrong at all. This would be great in a bar over a few pints of beer!
David I am not trying to say you’re wrong in any respect... You make some real valid points and I am enjoying this discussion.
Red Flag is an advanced aerial combat training exercise hosted by the U.S. Air Force at Nellis AFB Nevada (Las Vegas). At no point did I say or am i saying the Mustang is the BEST. Most Successful? I think a few F4U Corsair guys from the Pacific might differ on that opinion as they enjoyed a 11:1 kill ratio over the Japanese. LOL
Again not an apples to apples comparison, but the ability of the pilots and experience level is a HUGE factor.
Please don't take this wrong, I am just making a friendly discussion, not trying to say any one opinion is wrong at all. This would be great in a bar over a few pints of beer!
No Problem i dig that , i like and love this type of sec ww discusions. im sure the pilots of the corsair had one of if not the best kill ratio , but they never fought inline engines messersmits and focker wulf fighters now did they lol..
the japanese zero and mitsubitsie fighters where mainly target practis plains( turkey shoot) compeard to the german engeneering marvels.. they(japenese) where very low on on calliber guns and had NO armer protection at all....... best radial plain must have been the focker wulf with the p47 thunderbold on sec place with the corsair tird, sins he never fought in the same league as the p47. haveing said that the p47 became a straffing fighter when the mustang took his place.....
This is a great thread and not one I would expect to find on the site. The discussion of which aircraft is the best of WW2 strays from the original question of "The Planes are Messerschmidt's and Spitfires which one would you want to be in the cock pit of". Not flaming the fire here but I would choose my aircraft based on my enemy. Each has there advantages over others to be honest. Take the Zero for example. It was light and very maneuverable, but had no armor and light weight guns. Still it ruled the sky's for awhile.
I still say if I had to go into a fight against a Messerschmidt's I'd want a Mk16 Spitfire. That RR Griffin engine screamed and it had a clipped elliptical wing which is the best for all around performance.
__________________ Curtis
Pilots: We're not better than you, just way cooler.
RR merlin engine you meen lol. wel stastistics hase shown that the me109(latest version) was the spitfire,s equal in the dogfights. you know who disirfs the real medal of houner during the battle of britan "" the hawker hurricane"" the spitfire always got the credit but 80% of the plains that fought the germans where the Hurrican. shows you that a less disired airplain, with the rights stuff in the cockpit can do wonders http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=QWrYogVmPzU
Last edited by Roadrage David; 03-13-2008 at 02:09 PM.
RR merlin engine you meen lol. wel stastistics hase shown that the me109(latest version) was the spitfire,s equal in the dogfights. you know who disirfs the real medal of houner during the battle of britan "" the hawker hurricane"" the spitfire always got the credit but 80% of the plains that fought the germans where the Hurrican. shows you that a less disired airplain, with the rights stuff in the cockpit can do wonders http://nl.youtube.com/watch?v=QWrYogVmPzU
Later versions of the Spitfire had a RR Griffin. Here's a link that tells you about it.
I started this thread mainly because of my interest in flying both in cars and planes....be that as it may I could not help but notice on the show " Dogfights" that an American pilot was in trouble as he ran out of ammunition and was being chased by a German 109.....he mentioned that he had to hit the throttle and take the plane to a new power level by adding water/alcohol etc......after researching this thoroughly I notice the approach by the Germans and the Anglos was quite different......now we all know the Germans were pretty smart about building qaulity well engineered equipment...but what I thought was interesting that an supercharger/carb deal was faster for a few moments and the exta power this American Pilot was able to use kept him alive.
The pilot probably did not understand his engine that much and all he knew was he better push the throttle past the saftey gate and that it would add a bunch of power......I think it went from like 18 pounds of boost to 23 pounds and then used the water/alcohol injection to keep it from self destructing etc
We still have the blow thru carb guys and now with EFI here we have that bunch........but the carbs are still plenty fast and there is something to be said for keeping things simple....
You might want to look up Beatrice Shilling.....who helped those spitfires get out of trouble with a simple fix...she evidently was some kind of woman for those times..
You might want to look up Beatrice Shilling.....who helped those spitfires get out of trouble with a simple fix...she evidently was some kind of woman for those times..
Yes she was. Nice to see someone that knows of her. Oddly when the P-51 first came out with the RR Merlin it didn't do very well at high altitudes until a guy (who's name I can never remember) who worked for Packard came up with a simple and easy solution. One of those times when the last person you expected to have the answer fixed things.
__________________ Curtis
Pilots: We're not better than you, just way cooler.
I started this thread mainly because of my interest in flying both in cars and planes....be that as it may I could not help but notice on the show " Dogfights" that an American pilot was in trouble as he ran out of ammunition and was being chased by a German 109.....he mentioned that he had to hit the throttle and take the plane to a new power level by adding water/alcohol etc......after researching this thoroughly I notice the approach by the Germans and the Anglos was quite different......now we all know the Germans were pretty smart about building qaulity well engineered equipment...but what I thought was interesting that an supercharger/carb deal was faster for a few moments and the exta power this American Pilot was able to use kept him alive.
The pilot probably did not understand his engine that much and all he knew was he better push the throttle past the saftey gate and that it would add a bunch of power......I think it went from like 18 pounds of boost to 23 pounds and then used the water/alcohol injection to keep it from self destructing etc
We still have the blow thru carb guys and now with EFI here we have that bunch........but the carbs are still plenty fast and there is something to be said for keeping things simple....
You might want to look up Beatrice Shilling.....who helped those spitfires get out of trouble with a simple fix...she evidently was some kind of woman for those times..
The great Smokey Yunick mentions this in his book. After a pilot used the water/alcohol injection on the plane or 'red lined' it, The engines had to be pulled and overhauled. Smokey talks his way into flying one that had been redlined, to see what would happen. Needless to say he was very impressed!
the F4U corsair was the only WW2 bird outstanding enough to fight in korea as well.
it is the best piston engined fighter ever, from any country.
it is also flat out the baddest, coolest lookin' warbird that swings a prop.
there can be no dispute and resistance is futile.
nonbelievers will be fired upon by robert conrad himself.
he's not a fighter pilot but he plays one on tv!
(young guys will not get this, sorry!)
Brian Hobaugh SCCA National Tour June 2014
First Hemi 'Cuda Convertible Ever Built
Short clips: Goodguys Pleasanton autocross and pit videos
Hybrid Mode
