I was out at Spring Mountain today, and in an informal conversation with one of their senior officers, he was very complimentary regarding the professionalism and conduct of both the participants and spectators during this year's event -- self policing -- a nice job by all! Like most car guys, I go to events like this to look under the well-prepared cars, talk to their builders, and then watch them close-up to see how their mods perform. You could pack more spectators into an arena like Las Vegas Motor Speedway with big grandstands, but you would lose that close contact with the vehicles and the participants, and even with the sponsor's and part's suppliers (except for big decals on the fenders that you might see from the stands). My $.02 worth...
I hear you about the crowd Greg. There were several times in the pits that I played safety Nazi, and each time the people were totally cool about it. Usually they were having so much fun that they did not see what was happening around them.
Jimi, thanks for for the feedback. I do believe that the event should favor the street category. Street tires, street gas (no race gas), and if you really want to be picky, late model emissions legality. All three are required for a late model car to be legally licensed. Policing all of that would be a bear.
Reading through this thread, especially the parts about old vs. new, street car vs. race car I thought I would speak more from the purist side of things. I realize I will catch some s*** for this so fire away!
1. If you want a car to go fast around the track and cruise in comfort get a 911 or a Corvette, can't go wrong and they will most likely beat all comers at alot of AutoX, HPDE, Open Track type events with a good tire and minimal modification. You'll probably save alot of time and money vs. building a car also.
2. I would say that I am on the ultra-conservative side of things when it comes to street car vs. race car. Here is what constitutes a street car for me:
4 point roll bar maximum for hardtops GT-350 style or a head hoop on a space frame roadster or Cobra style car. Cars equipped in this manner won LeMans overall and class championships in the decade or decade preceding the era most of our cars were manufactured in, I think that spirit is important.
Front and rear windshields made from glass not lexan
Suspension bushings not rod ends
6 stage dry sump oiling shouldn't be necessary for a street car engine
A street car shouldn't need the same amount of braided line necessary to plumb a space shuttle
No "Jerico" style trans
I will be the first to admit that my interest in pro-touring is more the quality of the high end builds than the styling, I am more of a purist I enjoy the look and feel of a period correct car for what it is. If anything older cars have a big advantage over newer cars, simplicity, that I have yet to see really be exploited by alot of the 'ultimate' builds. Bottom line, a well prepped near stock Vette or 911 will smoke anything short of a 1969 McLaren M6GT in a new vs. old street challenge.
Safety: If you have a good seat, a 5 point harness and a 4 point bar on a road course, you'll be fine and probably the only thing to get hurt will be your pride and maybe checkbook from the car and Armco repairs. Safety shouldn't be taken for granted, but at this level you'll be okay in a well prepared car. Most tracks now also have so much runoff built in or retrofitted 'the wall' is becoming less of a concern at some places.
Also, sponsorship and product placement may have it's place but with some cars it's getting rediculous. Nothing worse than peeking under the hood and thinking that you're reading down the vendor line of the summit catalog from all the logo's, maybe be a little subtle.
I like building car's.I would rather build a car for Optima than buy one.I think what make's Optima so great is all the differant type's of car's.Stock/OEM,Race Car'sd,SMOY qualtiy P-T car's,Very Nice P-T car's,What ever The Race Director(Jimi Day) think's would make for a good show.I embrace the chance to run aginst the Likes of (Danny Pop,Mark Stielow,Kyle Tucker,Brian Finch,Brian Hobaugh.)This only make us better.I also belive if someone were to run off the track a 140mph they would be in deep **** having only a 4 point roll cage or single shelby style bar.I been told the Ferrari,911,BMW,guy's really don't want to come out and beat on their car's. If you Show up w/a bone stock camaro you will most likely finish dead last.Then decal's are on the car's so the sponsor's that fork out all that dough great a little some ting back.W/O the sponsors,these event could not be run,unless the eventree's fees being big buck's.I have been to 2 of the 4 events and they just keep getting better.
Last edited by coolwelder62; 11-16-2011 at 03:46 PM.
Safetey is a huge concern for me on a road course. That is why I put a cage in my car.
From the quote above
I would say that I am on the ultra-conservative side of things when it comes to street car vs. race car. Here is what constitutes a street car for me:
4 point roll bar maximum for hardtops GT-350 style or a head hoop on a space frame roadster or Cobra style car. Cars equipped in this manner won LeMans overall and class championships in the decade or decade preceding the era most of our cars were manufactured in, I think that spirit is important.
Safety: If you have a good seat, a 5 point harness and a 4 point bar on a road course, you'll be fine and probably the only thing to get hurt will be your pride and maybe checkbook from the car and Armco repairs. Safety shouldn't be taken for granted, but at this level you'll be okay in a well prepared car. Most tracks now also have so much runoff built in or retrofitted 'the wall' is becoming less of a concern at some places. .
I am a bit puzzled with this. Advancement in safety is always improving and why would we want to use 40+ year old technology and logic? Let's go back even further when they used a leather helmet.
Thunderhill in Nor Cal. is known for being a very safe track. But, it is about impossible to be 100% safe. Check out the video below. Yes, this was during a race, but this could have just as easily happened on a solo run like at so many of the Pro-Touring events we run. I don't know about you, but if this was me, I would be glad I have more than a 4 point cage. He just lost his brakes and you will see what happens.
__________________
Brian Hobaugh
1965 Corvette
1973 Camaro
2003 Z06
Last edited by 73CPCAMARO; 11-16-2011 at 03:25 PM.
Ya never know when the brakes are going to fail - or the guy just ahead of you dumps his crankcase all over the track... or a tire blows...
I've got video of a guy that passes me and then starts spraying coolant or oil all over the place... I backed off and let him go and slowed a bit to see what was going to happen - but I was lucky that I saw it first and he didn't just do a big dump on the track right in front of me.
Several of us (on Lat G) have been down that straight and know you're hauling some serious butt down there - then it's downshift and HARD on the brakes to make the 90* !
That driver did a good job not wrecking the other guys car... so kudos to him huh?
I know what your trying to say and safety should be number one period but that was just straight up a dumb move and driver error.
I know that turn well and he could have waited till the end of 14 and on to the straight to make the pass.
Didn't look to me like he intended to pass -- looks to me like he just did a good job when he went for the brakes and they weren't there.... he blew by the guy because the other driver was on his brakes. You know how much you need to scrub off down there... and if you didn't have any brakes -- you're going to blow off there just like this guy did.
Brian Hobaugh SCCA National Tour June 2014
First Hemi 'Cuda Convertible Ever Built
Short clips: Goodguys Pleasanton autocross and pit videos
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