Ron --- When you have a chance -- You are welcome to tear me a new you know what with comments on my driving... etc (if you've watched the videos). Others may learn from my mistakes and poor judgement. And to me - that's what it's all about. Charley has already destroyed any ego I had.
I'm just glad Ron hasn't shared publically his comments on my driving on the autocross course last weekend.
I sent him the videos and my thoughts on what was going on and he immediately showed me some things that I was doing wrong...and how correcting them would make the car handle better and be faster on the clock. I can't wait for my next event now just to try to put his suggestions into action.
He is an invaluable resource for this sort of thing. We are so fortunate just to have him hanging around to show us the ropes.
__________________
Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
First session Sunday was entertaining, casual warm up lap, the first green flag lap had all the enthusiasm of a cool down lap, then heading into T1 on lap 3 the Cayman ahead of the Z06 I was following just about lost it on the exit for some added excitement, then the instructor in the white Mustang (ffffast) made an appearance, then before you know it's time to come in.
What I really enjoyed was the fact that the Cayman had nothing on the 2-Eleven off the corners and down the straight, I was feathering throttle following it, not the case with the Z06 though. Don't discount those little 1.8 liters!
The Cayman needs to drop back down a group (yellow) and go back to driving school.... he's so far off the apex cones that it's obvious he has ZERO idea what they're telling him!
For the newbs (myself included)... the orange cone on the corners is an APEX marker... you basically want to try to touch it if you can in EVERY corner if you have the line to yourself (which we always do because we are not allowed to be 2 wide in a corner)... and HITTING the apex will have you EXIT properly. Take the apex WIDE and you run out of track on the exit. That's what happened to the Cayman in T1... Go back and see that he's in the middle of the track at the apex -- then he's way wide on exit -- and sees the edge of the track coming up to bite his ass.... and he tries to dial the car back in -- and has the ass end trying to come around on him. Rookie mistake.... but more importantly -- he never once was anywhere near the apex in any corner.
If you watch -- there is an APEX marker --- and on EXIT there is an EXIT marker.... You want to clip the apex and let the car come out to the exit cone ---- then it's "punch it! I know the road!" LOL
I'm just glad Ron SUTTON hasn't shared publically his comments on my driving on the autocross course last weekend.He is an invaluable resource for this sort of thing. We are so fortunate just to have him hanging around to show us the ropes.
I've never had a better weekend of driving than I just had with him in my pit!
There is nothing better than having a car that you trust and that acts the exact same way every time you go out. That is what I was having trouble with... because I was all over the map on tire pressures -- because I didn't know when I should be checking them and setting them etc. NOW I KNOW!
I learned so much - which made my driving better - which made the weekend more FUN.... That was my goal. It was so good (the weekend) and we learned so much - that I have now engaged Ron to help me again at Sonoma Raceway August 2nd and 3rd. Not sure what we'll work on -- but it will be whatever it will be -- THE DRIVER (nut behind the wheel) is what needs the most work as far as I'm concerned.... but his efforts just getting simple things dialed in on the car was just WOW! Who knew! The one weekend forever changed how the car drives.... and that's why I say it's the best money I ever spent on a car. What I learned in one weekend will help with every car I ever drive on a track. It's all transferable information.
I just finished 29th out of 109 drivers in an SCCA Solo event with a ton of very experienced drivers in autocross specific type cars with a car not designed for autocross at all, that is on street tires, with a driver that doesn't know what he is doing...all because the car runs a setup Ron Sutton designed for a car he has never seen in person.
'nuff said...
I'm pretty familiar with the feeling you are talking about Greg...and it's awesome!
__________________
Lance
1985 Monte Carlo SS Street Car
I certainly cannot thank Ron enough. What he brought to the forefront were invaluable tools and thought processes for future events.
No more pulling into the pit parking the car and BSing with the nearest ear. The new standard operating procedure when exiting the track is get to the pit quickly dismount grab the infrared thermometer, tire pyrometer, and pressure gauge and get to work logging data.
At future events I'll further micromanage every detail and movement I make.
What I was really tried to improve on over the 2 days was braking/downshifting timing and modulation, turn-in points, apex and exit points, along with steering inputs and throttle application. When done right it should be like listening well orchestrated symphony........IMO.
Ron - Thanks for enhancing "the experience." As Greg previously mentioned - feel free to point out my shortcomings in the video. I have no problem being an example for a class.
I certainly cannot thank Ron enough. What he brought to the forefront were invaluable tools and thought processes for future events.
No more pulling into the pit parking the car and BSing with the nearest ear. The new standard operating procedure when exiting the track is get to the pit quickly dismount grab the infrared thermometer, tire pyrometer, and pressure gauge and get to work logging data.
At future events I'll further micromanage every detail and movement I make.
What I was really tried to improve on over the 2 days was braking/downshifting timing and modulation, turn-in points, apex and exit points, along with steering inputs and throttle application. When done right it should be like listening well orchestrated symphony........IMO.
Ron - Thanks for enhancing "the experience." As Greg previously mentioned - feel free to point out my shortcomings in the video. I have no problem being an example for a class.
Let us know when you find that pedal on the right....
LOL HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
The video with the Vette and the Cayman.... I thought you three were driving to the Mall on a Sunday morning. I was tense by the time I got done watching that thing! I was like "Dude! <the Cayman> Hit the f'n apex -- and PUNCH IT I KNOW THE ROAD". Then I fell asleep.
Let us know when you find that pedal on the right....
LOL HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
The video with the Vette and the Cayman.... I thought you three were driving to the Mall on a Sunday morning. I was tense by the time I got done watching that thing! I was like "Dude! <the Cayman> Hit the f'n apex -- and PUNCH IT I KNOW THE ROAD". Then I fell asleep.
My primary goal for the two days was obtained.
.............I did not have to answer your question "which corner did you run out of talent in?"
I certainly cannot thank Ron enough. What he brought to the forefront were invaluable tools and thought processes for future events.
No more pulling into the pit parking the car and BSing with the nearest ear. The new standard operating procedure when exiting the track is get to the pit quickly dismount grab the infrared thermometer, tire pyrometer, and pressure gauge and get to work logging data.
At future events I'll further micromanage every detail and movement I make.
What I was really tried to improve on over the 2 days was braking/downshifting timing and modulation, turn-in points, apex and exit points, along with steering inputs and throttle application. When done right it should be like listening well orchestrated symphony........IMO.
Ron - Thanks for enhancing "the experience." As Greg previously mentioned - feel free to point out my shortcomings in the video. I have no problem being an example for a class.
Hi Sieg,
It's hard to point out shortcomings, because your goal was to get some track time, have fun & not tear up Greg's toy. You achieved that very well.
The main issue with driving that speedy little car on track is so many other cars were slower. As they bunch up in front of you ... a guy has to ask himself is the risk of passing them all versus the gain ... when your goals are to simply get some track time, have fun & not tear up Greg's toy.
If you were racing, or running alone for fast time, the tips I would offer are:
a. Use ALL the track ... plus 2"
b. Work on carrying more corner entry speed by carrying full throttle farther & brake later into the corner ... 2' at a time ... until the rear end gets a tick free under braking, then back up this point until you regain good entry grip.
c. Next, work on carrying more mid-corner speed by braking less ... softer & shorter ... a little less each time ... until the rear end gets a tick free during the roll through zone (or pushes, depending on the set-up) then increase the braking distance until you regain good grip through the roll through zone.
* When deciding to brake harder versus longer to bring the roll through zone speed back down to achieve grip ... it is typically better to brake longer & softer as compared to harder & shorter. Braking harder has a tendency to upset the car more & "surprise" the tires. Plus braking soft longer keeps the nose planted longer for front tire grip.
d. Turn in later on most corners. Apex later.
e. On tight corners ... test & compare running a different line where you keep the car out wide longer & turn in later ... and turn in harder (at a higher degree) ... setting up your corner exit to be lower & straighter. Depending on the degree, I call this a 70/30 strategy (or if done to a lesser degree a 60/40 strategy). The goal is do 70% of the turning in the first half of the corner & only 30% of the turning on exit. This better matches the goals of matching slowing the car with more turning on entry & allowing faster throttle roll on due to the higher rear tire grip of the straighter exit line.
Many refer to this as simply a late apex style, but that's only partially accurate, as we can run a late apex and still not have the car turned 70% by mid way. In typical high powered cars, this 70/30 strategy is "usually" the faster way around tight radius corners.
* But ... in some super low powered, light, good handling cars ... sometimes the fastest way is to run the biggest radius possible through tight corners ... to keep the rolling speed & exit speed as high as possible. We won a lot Formula Ford races there at T-Hill with this strategy. These cars only weigh 900# & have 110hp. In the F2000 cars, with more power & down force, this wasn't necessary.
The Lotus is part way between that and typical track car. So I'd try both ways with corner segment timers to know for sure.
Brian Hobaugh SCCA National Tour June 2014
First Hemi 'Cuda Convertible Ever Built
Short clips: Goodguys Pleasanton autocross and pit videos
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