Consensus on big bar/soft spring?

[Rod P]

GREAT VIDEO Greg!
the key to any of the suspension choices is balance!
when you assemble the suspension you dont just shove big bars on and soft springs and its all golden.....balance.... what does the car weigh, control arm lengths, pivot points for arms and rear suspension links, wheel base, track width, caster, camber, ride height, spring preload, sway bar ratio's, pivot points from center line, Shock valving and the LIST goes on, but once you have all of that and you combine it to find the sweet spot for that car (here is were experience and knowledge help) you get a car that is easy to push to the limits and has the desired neutral effect,,,and now that you get that... you can lightly tweak the car for under or over-steer to help with each track you encounter

[Ron Sutton]

Originally Posted by Rod P

GREAT VIDEO Greg!
the key to any of the suspension choices is balance!
when you assemble the suspension you dont just shove big bars on and soft springs and its all golden.....balance.... what does the car weigh, control arm lengths, pivot points for arms and rear suspension links, wheel base, track width, caster, camber, ride height, spring preload, sway bar ratio's, pivot points from center line, Shock valving and the LIST goes on, but once you have all of that and you combine it to find the sweet spot for that car (here is were experience and knowledge help) you get a car that is easy to push to the limits and has the desired neutral effect,,,and now that you get that... you can lightly tweak the car for under or over-steer to help with each track you encounter

"Like"

[Ron Sutton]

Hey Greg Weld,
Thanks for the kind words & sharing your experiences. We do have a lot of fun at the track.

[Flash68]

Originally Posted by Rod P

GREAT VIDEO Greg!
the key to any of the suspension choices is balance!
when you assemble the suspension you dont just shove big bars on and soft springs and its all golden.....balance.... what does the car weigh, control arm lengths, pivot points for arms and rear suspension links, wheel base, track width, caster, camber, ride height, spring preload, sway bar ratio's, pivot points from center line, Shock valving and the LIST goes on, but once you have all of that and you combine it to find the sweet spot for that car (here is were experience and knowledge help) you get a car that is easy to push to the limits and has the desired neutral effect,,,and now that you get that... you can lightly tweak the car for under or over-steer to help with each track you encounter

Sounds complicated Rod.

[Panteracer]

I also think the shock and spring technology has
come light years recently.. turning knobs actually does
something compared to times of the past.... guys like Ron know how
to interact the two in order to get the most out of a setup

I need to change my hood and front nose on my bird to
get over 100lbs off the front end (hopefully this winter)
then I can measure and weigh things for a real conversation
with Ron

Bob

[SSLance]

Heck, I'm just glad Greg raised his camera a half inch so now I don't have to strain my neck to look over his hood!



Nice driving Greg! Know what I noticed most besides your great lines...nary a whimper from the tires when you turn in to a corner. When you wanted to turn in, it just reacts smoothly and confidently. That makes everything else so much nicer when trying to get faster.

[Rod P]

Originally Posted by Flash68

Sounds complicated Rod.

ha ha ha ha ha ...... yes it is! if it was easy everyone would be fast.....now when you getting your ass back out there? and drive? hope your doing well brother its been a minute

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by SSLance

Heck, I'm just glad Greg raised his camera a half inch so now I don't have to strain my neck to look over his hood!



Nice driving Greg! Know what I noticed most besides your great lines...nary a whimper from the tires when you turn in to a corner. When you wanted to turn in, it just reacts smoothly and confidently. That makes everything else so much nicer when trying to get faster.

I'm right there with ya Lance -- when I watch those videos I'm trying my damnedest to sit up in my chair and and see over.... LOL


I hope people understand the points I'm trying to make using that video.... that is NOT about me... I own the car -- before and after --- I could have NEVER driven like that before the RSRT suspension re-do! NEVER! My driving has improved since we did this - but not because of anything I've done in particular.... but the CAR and the new suspension has allowed RON to turn into a coach instead of a hand holder. His coaching is every bit as valuable as his suspension knowledge. The two do work together and I get it.. but the one thing (car) has to work - before the other can do his job. I used to just fight that car to the death every session.... and as I've said before - now I don't want the sessions, or the weekend to end. I can't tell you how much of a change that has been.

I used to think it was ME... that I just sucked as a driver - that my buddies Charlie / Chet / Pete were just so much better drivers than I was.... that it was braking too deep - or that I was off line - or that I was going too fast for my ability.... I used to tell myself - WTF - It's just an old Mustang... what do you expect? Little did I know what I could expect!

Now -- when I see people WAY down track.... I know I'm catching them and I'm going to do so EASILY... I don't have to drive over my head (very low skill level)... I just know the car is beyond capable. Can't remember where I was on track - and Sutton radios me that the next car(s) to catch is a "X" whatever... Vette I think.... I don't respond to him immediately... but when I do - I told him "oh hell, I'm past them already". LOL. We both got a chuckle going on that one!

Back to Maier -- which kind of started all of this (and also the very unsportsmanlike bickering).... If I was going to auto cross.... I'd be talking to him. I'd be talking to several people... I have ZERO auto cross experience - and don't intend to change that at all. It's just not something I want to do. But I look at SSLance and the gains and improvements he's seen with his car... and it's not a car I would expect to see at ANY auto cross event! You read his thread and you'll see he has had similar improvements to his set up --- and he's done this in stages -- which is the way I would assume most would do. So you don't have to go out and cut your car up to gain some meaningful handling change.

[Rod P]

Originally Posted by Flash68

Sounds complicated Rod.

so on the second part of that is why I often recommend using a kit from a single manufacture as much as possible, and what ever they dont make find out what they recommend....thats a great place to start.... like if your going to use Mike Maier suspension stuff and since he doesn't make a shock what does he prefer to run... what does he like for steering components, and so on...and that would be what is optimal for his suspension....

I'm not saying that just because you use one manufactures stuff on the whole car the car will be perfect...I recently worked on a car that had awesome chassis and suspension products built by one single company and once all the measurements that i described earlier where gone over I still had to fix some issues with stuff within allowable parameters....there suspension required tall lower ball joints and the steering rack to be moved upwards different springs than they sold in there kit along with a shock valving change and a bumpsteer kit....

and after that the car was easier to drive and neutral ....that owner is very happy now

its not easy

[Ron Sutton]

Originally Posted by Rod P

its not easy

What ?!?!