Speedtech's new 3rd Gen Camaro suspension

[Ron Sutton]

Originally Posted by James OLC

As I suddenly seem to have some of these around this house I will be watching your development program with interest.

Hey James,

The geometry on this clip is in line with my TA2 race clip, except the Speedtech clip puts the roll center in the optimum spot regardless of how much you travel the front end. This is the first time I've achieved this ... so this clip would work awesome for any setup a person chooses. So if someone runs a stiff spring set-up & only travels the front end around an inch ... the roll center is at 2" above ground, which is optimum for that setup. If they high travel the front end ... say 3" ... with soft springs & a larger sway bar ... the roll center is at ground level ... again, optimum for that setup. in moderate travel ... around 2" ... the RC is at 1" - perfect.

The dual power Sweet rack will handle the load from the high grip suspension & 315 front tires (TW200 or slicks) with ease. No rebuilt $300 OEM racks here. This puppy cost almost $1000, but it is built to take the loads we're creating these days.

I forget if you have my AutoX-Star or Track-Star valved Ridetech shocks on the OLC Camaro. But these clips are available with my Track-Star "secret sauce" digressive valved shocks in single or triple adjustable.

* Quick side note: On Friday May 27th, I went shock testing with a championship GT team that races in the Western Endurance GT car series at Buttonwillow (because it's a bumpy track - perfect for shock testing). They ran a best of 1:49.9 with their Bilstein race shocks. Then ran a best of 1:46.8 ... 3.1 seconds quicker ... my Track-Star valved Ridetech triples. The driver couldn't believe the grip increase. These are the same shocks I make available to the Pro-Touring world, and are optional on this Speedtech clip.

All the geometry on this Speedtech ExtReme front clip is spot on:
* Roll Center location & dynamic migration - Optimum grip
* Bump steer changes only .001" in 3" travel
* Anti-dive is 40% - allowing us to run softer springs & still achieve a low roll angle
* Ackerman is 100% - Creating optimum slip angle on inside front tire
* Dynamic Camber/Caster creates optimum contact patches on BOTH front tires
* Jacking effect is Nil - allowing softer springs & still achieve a low roll angle
* Front Sway bar rate range is from 400# to over 3000#

This would be extremely racy for your new 3rd gen.

[James OLC]

Thanks Ron - we can chat more (I owe you a call as it is).

The '89 has been evolving well but the last weekend out was a tad cold and wet:



This should be a fun week though, I sourced a hood, fenders, and quarter panels from an IROC series car - they should finally be here this week (along with a new set of Toyo RR tires).

Suspension is about "maxed" out for the "stock" design so I am always looking at new options.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Thanks for chiming in Ron!

That's a pretty sweet sleeper there Tuske! I think another should definitely be on the build list!

Looks like fun James! "Suspension is about "maxed" out for the "stock" design so I am always looking at new options." We anticipate being able to help with that!

[Evan Iroc-Z]

I'm all in. I keep going back and forth on selling mine, but maybe with the right set of parts I would be willing to hang onto it.

[InfernalVortex]

I love mine but most of my suspension work has been done for a while. Im usually top 5 in raw times at the local autocrosses so I feel like the car works really well.

1. Ground clearance with big exhaust is a pain on these cars. Thats because of the transmission crossmember. I have an old Skulte piece that has clearance for duals, but he doesnt make them anymore. Until Holley's new LS swap crossmember, there isnt much available (I think Hawks has some flimsy looking piece) in terms of off the shelf crossmembers with decent dual exhaust clearance. Check out Holley's piece and see if you guys can do something like that. It's a niche in the market that i think gets ignored. Everyone makes these huge square tube crossmembers that hang WAAAAY too low. Obviously you'd need different ones for a T56 or a T5 or a 700r4 vs a LS 4l60e, but I just feel lik ethat's something all the normal performance parts fabricators totally ignore.

2. And my pet issue, it'd be cool to have a crossmember like that with a torque arm mount packaged on it. Or perhaps some sort of standalone torque arm crossmember that isnt super short. I avoid the super short ones for the handling stuff... I'd rather it not get upset on front-rear weight transfers. Im not sure if your crossmember has a torque arm mount or not, yet.

There are some obscure but very effective suspension modifications that tweak the roll centers and roll axis that have enormous benefits in car stability. I woudlnt call it maxed out. I'd call it pretty flawed, actually, but it has a lot of potential. Note that the fourth gens with their SLA front suspension dont have major transition stability problems even though they have the same rear suspension.

Ron Sutton Race Technology geometry built-in.
Strong Box type laser cut and jig welded construction - reduced weight over factory subframe.
Special subframe width & shape allowing 315 front tires.
Next-Gen ATS 7075 Forged Aluminum Spindles.
High-Ackerman steering arms for ATS spindles.
C7 heavy duty bearings & hubs.
Speedtech high clearance upper & lower tubular control arms
Upper control arms feature additional caster adjustability.
Control arms powder coated gloss black and fully assembled with Delrin bushings.
3-piece Speedway Engineering sway bar – Choice of rates from 400# to 1300#
Sweet racing DUAL POWER rack & pinion steering.
Accepts LSX engines with Speedtech fabricated oil pan and motor mounts.
Adjustable engine frame stands allows 3/4" fore & aft range.
Fully adjustable rear cross member fits all GM transmissions as well as T-56 and TKO.
Factory alignment holes offer ease of aligning frame to body and bumpers.
Mounting hardware, instructions, and custom alignment specs.
Comes bare. Powder coat options available.
Built-in tow/tie down hooks eliminate strapping around painted frames.
Ridetech single adjustable coil-over shocks, including delrin thrust washers & adjusting wrench.
Hypercoil coil-over springs – Wide choice of rates.

Im eagerly awaiting to see how much of this you guys can implement. There have been a lot of us waiting for a decent fast ratio, decent turn radius power rack setup for these cars! Not sure if a full front subframe is really a possibility given how these cars are put together...

[Ron Sutton]

Originally Posted by InfernalVortex

Im eagerly awaiting to see how much of this you guys can implement. There have been a lot of us waiting for a decent fast ratio, decent turn radius power rack setup for these cars! Not sure if a full front subframe is really a possibility given how these cars are put together...

It is a ways off before Speedtech has this front suspension clip ready to sell ... primarily because there are ExtReme clips & full frame designs for other cars ahead of it.

When we replace the clip with my new design, it will achieve everything I've listed. For all intents & purposes, the suspension & steering design is done. What Speedtech will work on .... down the road ... is where & how to tie the new clip into the unibody.

A full clip is doable. Frankly, almost anything is doable with fabrication. It just won't be a simple "bolt-in" like the clips for 1st & 2nd Gen F-bodies & 68-74 X-Bodies (Novas, etc).

While I am excited this clip is coming down the road ... there are several other cars getting ExtReme clips and/or frames before it. Really looking forward to the completion of the 68-72 A-Body ExtReme Chassis, and subsequently the 64-67 A-Body ExtReme Chassis.

[InfernalVortex]

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton

It is a ways off before Speedtech has this front suspension clip ready to sell ... primarily because there are ExtReme clips & full frame designs for other cars ahead of it.

When we replace the clip with my new design, it will achieve everything I've listed. For all intents & purposes, the suspension & steering design is done. What Speedtech will work on .... down the road ... is where & how to tie the new clip into the unibody.

A full clip is doable. Frankly, almost anything is doable with fabrication. It just won't be a simple "bolt-in" like the clips for 1st & 2nd Gen F-bodies & 68-74 X-Bodies (Novas, etc).

While I am excited this clip is coming down the road ... there are several other cars getting ExtReme clips and/or frames before it. Really looking forward to the completion of the 68-72 A-Body ExtReme Chassis, and subsequently the 64-67 A-Body ExtReme Chassis.

Given how these cars are currently valued, I'd do the same. They will pick up, but it's not quite their time to shine yet. The market for something that extensive probably hasnt truly materialized yet.

[HellPhish89]

Originally Posted by Ron Sutton

It is a ways off before Speedtech has this front suspension clip ready to sell ... primarily because there are ExtReme clips & full frame designs for other cars ahead of it.

When we replace the clip with my new design, it will achieve everything I've listed. For all intents & purposes, the suspension & steering design is done. What Speedtech will work on .... down the road ... is where & how to tie the new clip into the unibody.

A full clip is doable. Frankly, almost anything is doable with fabrication. It just won't be a simple "bolt-in" like the clips for 1st & 2nd Gen F-bodies & 68-74 X-Bodies (Novas, etc).

While I am excited this clip is coming down the road ... there are several other cars getting ExtReme clips and/or frames before it. Really looking forward to the completion of the 68-72 A-Body ExtReme Chassis, and subsequently the 64-67 A-Body ExtReme Chassis.

2 big things many 3rd gen fbody owners would like:

a choice of spindles.

ability to add a power rack and pinion.

there are quite a few who want spindles and rack and pinion. there have been various companies that have cast new spindles and fabricated them and ultimately they all disappeared.

[Ben@SpeedTech]

Thanks for the insight Infernal V. All that is great feedback and things we can think about. We just recently launched a new frame connector/ lateral cross brace/ torque arm front mount for the 1st gen cars. Something like this will be on the list of can we implement it for the 3rd gens too. Currently we use a bolt in crossmember for our Torque arm front mounts. We also typically use an adjustable trans crossmember for different trans opttions. We're all about low stance and lots of ground clearance so we'll pay attention to your comments as we get into the design. Thanks again!