Ousci

[Gscherer78ta]

I was one of the Vintage guys to participate and I had a blast doing it! I was very happy with my results and at the end of the day, the event made me feel like I was truly a race car driver. I am just doing this for fun and won't ever be competitive because of Bret's rule no 3. I'm not complaining here, where I spend my money is my choice alone. I will keep coming to as many events as my budget allows and I'll have a blast doing so with the equipment I have.

It's curious to me that more of the builds on this site and Pro-touring don't attend, I read a lot about old cars not being competitive with the modern Vette's, Mustangs and Camaro's and certainly there are people driving those cars that are incredibly fast. The super fast ones that seem to get the most attention on here are not the majority though. I wish that was the message being portrayed here! There are many folks driving their modern cars that aren't the fastest. Recall a few years ago Danny was driving a vintage car and was winning back then too...

[Chad-1stGen]

Originally Posted by So Cal Camaro

The sponsors like Detroit Speed offer suspension parts for 5th gens, in addition to Vintage cars, K&N/Spectre offer parts for all year cars, Falken doesn't care if the car is new or old using their tires. Same for Lingenfelter, Holley & Wilwood brakes, they all sell parts for all year cars. The sponsors have adapted to the new world, so while you all like to complain about c5 Corvettes, Evo's or 5th gen Camaro's running in the event, if we didn't run, there would likely be no events as the Vintage guys are not coming out in force to the USCA qualifier events.

There were only 128 GTV cars registered all year at the 9 USCA events, and about 30 of those participated in more than one event to try and qualify for the OUSCI event. If the vintage cars want to be represented in greater numbers all they have to do is sign up and accumulate enough points to make the big show, like the EVO guys from RS Motors did.

They limit the number of entries, so fill the field at each event with as many vintage cars as you all can. USCA and Optima put on great events that provide all of us with a playground to drive the piss out of our cars and get some great seat time, which I do with a lot of friends at events. Do I ever expect to win the event? No, Do I have any less fun seeing where I stack up? No and I finished 57th overall...I am happily looking forward to the 2016 season!

Originally Posted by GregWeld

That is EXACTLY what needed to be said.... Sign up & Participate. The series started with "us" -- "us" didn't show up to play.

I can't agree with this sentiment more. I think the variety of cars at USCA events is great and just hope us vintage protouring guys can continue to show up in reasonable numbers. I already was a huge fan of the class system introduced (GTV, GT, GTL, etc.) and maybe some version of that can make it to the OUSCI too. Maybe there continues to be the "ultimate street car" crowned with some other recognition for class winners?

Regarding the number of GTV guys... The population of protouring cars in general is already a fairly small segment of the overall car hobby. Look at Goodguys events. These events are targeted towards older/vintage cars and draws thousands and thousands of cars to each show and when you walk around how many of them are trully build with a focus on protouring/handling beyond some big wheels and bling?. I'd say well under 10%. Of that group less than 100 actually participate in the autocross portion.

Then look at open track days. In SoCal I see people of all walks of life from 18 year olds with beater civics to older wealthy dudes with bad ass race cars at these events. What I don't see are other vintage muscle cars unless I attend a USCA event or shelby club event. out of 80-90 cars that typically attend an open track day in SoCal I'm 99% of the time the only one.

If series like USCA are to continue to grow I think they have to appeal to a pretty broad group of participants.

All I know is that I can't wait to attend some USCA events in 2016! And for any of my fellow GTV type car owners on the fence about coming because you think you won't be competitive.... just come out and try it! There is a reason that when Jimi goes over goals of each event that competition is way down at 4th. I tell people all the time that I can always go home happy with a smile on my face when I attend any event as long as I improve throughout the day. My #1 "competition" is myself and I love it when my last lap in autocross or session on the road course yields my fastest time regardless of where my overall rank is.

[Panteracer]

I remember years ago some of the new vettes came out and
SCCA autocross boys finally had to make a B-Street prepared vintage
class for the Older Vettes.. then a Mazda twin turbo car came out and
was later moved out of the newer Vette class... I was running E-Street
prepared (pony cars) and the 4wd Subaru was put in the class and later the EVO

Classes are tough to regulate...

Optima is the gauge of how someone can do against everyone
Trying to have one set of rules is difficult.. I think they have done
a pretty good job... Everyone wants to do this event and with
all the qualifiers you can run any of them and maybe make the big show

I have to agree you will not get more seat time at any other event
that is around.. I ran 13-14 stop boxes and 14 autocrosses... any other
place you are lucky to get 5 runs

I find it a place to help dial the car in along with trying to get the
driver somewhat better.... time in the car is how you get there
Trying to beat Popp, Maier or Houbaugh is something that is hard
to do as that they have done it since they were able to drive
and have years of seat time and talent- something we all look for

Being able to drive the car hard and have fun is what it is all about
I feel lucky just to run my cars as often as I do and intend to keep
at it as long as I can

thanks to Jimi,Cam,Optima and all the sponsers for giving us the chance
and to the vendors that come up with all the great things that make
our cars run better

Bob

[GrabberGT]

Originally Posted by DBasher

Bring on the Unlimited class!! The more I look at the Dusold Camaro the more I know that these builds need a place to run. Tube chassis, full cage, twin turbo LS7...who wouldn't want to see that run?

As long as they can complete the road portion and show that they're legal in their home state they should be able to run. Look at the draw that the ProMod "streetcars" bring at Drag Week.....trickle down engineering

I like it and do away with exhibition as well. Let those drivers play in Unlimited. But the real question is... where do you draw the line between what is an unlimited and isnt? Maybe call it the "Ultimate" class and it be the only class to run for the Ultimate Streetcar title. Many of these cars we consider "race cars" will move there on their own just to have a shot at the title.

[DBasher]

Originally Posted by GrabberGT

I like it and do away with exhibition as well. Let those drivers play in Unlimited. But the real question is... where do you draw the line between what is an unlimited and isnt? Maybe call it the "Ultimate" class and it be the only class to run for the Ultimate Streetcar title. Many of these cars we consider "race cars" will move there on their own just to have a shot at the title.

Minimum weight 3000#
Licensed and registered
200TW
Stock WB and maybe original "style" panels
That's it, anything goes! Frickin CanAm street cars!

It's the direction people are going anyways, why not embrace it instead of saying they can't run.
That's it, I'm writing a letter.


Dear Jimi,

[SSLance]

This post comes from a guy (in case some don't already know ) with about 3 years experience in this part of the hobby, who drives what he thinks is a Vintage Muscle car, and has been very active in helping to create the CAM classes in the SCCA as well as participate in a few USCA qualifying events.

The SCCA and the USCA (my car is too new for Good Guys) have their work cut out for them coming up with ways to keep putting on quality events that create enough of a fun\dollar ratio to keep the registrations full. Their success so far shows they are up to the task. I really like that the SCCA and USCA are working together to create like kind classes for our types of cars to run in, I hope they also work together to work around each other's schedules to allow entrants to continue to attend events in both series easily.

Some of the most fun I've had as an entrant at these types of events were at events that I'm certain lost money and were considered unsuccessful, and some of least fun events I've participated in were probably considered successful by those that put it on. I'm not sure there is a good answer for this.

All I know is I am personally going to continue to pick and choose the events I attend based solely on the expected fun vs dollar cost ratio. This is why I declined the invitation that I earned to the 2015 OUSCI...I just couldn't see the fun\dollar ratio (for me personally) being anywhere near the point I have to have it to enjoy myself. Certainly there are many others out there that are able to put that ratio into their happy window. The rules, classes, point structure, ability to compete fairly and win all come secondary for this participant...they count...and are looked at when deciding where to go, but the fun factor will continue to be my priority. Distance to travel to an event is a major factor in this. The USCA seems to have forgotten the Midwest Region a little bit this year and I'm sure there are reasons for that...hopefully in future years they'll find ways to come back this way.


Regarding classes and rules, both the SCCA and USCA are tip toeing around a line that is very hard to discern (race car vs street car) and everyone seems to have their own opinion on where that line should be...when in fact that line is in a different spot for just about everyone of us. I can speak from experience that making the masses happy when dealing with that line while at the same time putting on events that are economically sustainable and fun for the entrants (and the spectators or possible future entrants) is a near impossible feat. Someone is bound to get butt hurt if they take it too seriously no matter where that line is.

[Chad-1stGen]

This thread had me thinking about the USCI and how the GTV cars stacked up against each other. So I parsed the results just for fun. As I've already said fun and seat time are more imporatant to me than all out competition. There are 32 (out of 84 total) pre 1990 cars listed on the USCI results page. Of those 17 managed to score points.

Excluding the road ralley and design & engineering here is how those 17 cars stack up against eachother. Note I didn't separate the GTL cars from the pre 1990 cars so this includes both.

[mfain]

Originally Posted by DBasher

Minimum weight 3000#
Licensed and registered
200TW
Stock WB and maybe original "style" panels
That's it, anything goes! Frickin CanAm street cars!

It's the direction people are going anyways, why not embrace it instead of saying they can't run.
That's it, I'm writing a letter.


Dear Jimi,

Here we go again - another rule. What's with this 3000# minimum?

Pappy

[Panteracer]

Since someone said Can Am... lets do the West Coast version
of modern day Can Am... engine in the front... needs a roof
and other than that go..

like... Merc9.com

Bob

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by mfain

Here we go again - another rule. What's with this 3000# minimum?

Pappy

My stripped out Mustang weighs 2975 with me in it..... and it's as far from a "street car" as you could get. LOL My Lotus 2 11 - which is street legal in Europe -- 1470 #'s... OUT!

So I'm out!


The new one I'm toying with 2500 #'s with me in it.... Out again.


It's okay -- gives me good excuses to not have to show my lousy driving skills.