Automatic Vs Manual

[frankv11]

Nothing more fun than real 6 speed.
I've been running my 04 silverado w t56 and 4.88 gears for about 8 years and its fun everyday.

[Vegas69]

I was talking about using something high end that is more instantaneous. The driver tends to be a limiting factor around here and setting these cars up to heel toe with stock controls isn't much of an option. Certainly not saying I would build one, but I do think it could be great in the right hands with experience. Greg, how many times have you been on the track with a stick car?

[Stuart Adams]

The AMG car I had ran great but the paddling the tranny was a joke. Delayed and sluggish. Automatic type cars should stay that. Shifting with paddles is a cool concept but it does not replace the interaction of the body/ car interaction of grabbing gears. A 69 camaro had to be manual but my Duremax 7 speed auto is magnifico.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Vegas69

Greg, how many times have you been on the track with a stick car?

Counting all the driving schools -- and my own car --- that would be in the 100's of laps...

Mazda open wheel cars
ZO6's -- C4's and C5's and C6's
Camaros

All sticks...

More control both up and down shifts... Not as unsettling to the car as the STREET style trannys in the S63 and the R8... while they rev match -- it's still abrupt... and the part I dislike the most is trying to find the f'n paddles!

[TMIProducts]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Counting all the driving schools -- and my own car --- that would be in the 100's of laps...

Mazda open wheel cars
ZO6's -- C4's and C5's and C6's
Camaros

All sticks...

More control both up and down shifts... Not as unsettling to the car as the STREET style trannys in the S63 and the R8... while they rev match -- it's still abrupt... and the part I dislike the most is trying to find the f'n paddles!

I think you've hit the nail on the head when you talked about trying to find the shifter. That makes perfect sense. With a manual, your hand is always on the shifter, or at least you know where the shifter is at. In the F1 setting it works because lock to lock is only 180 degrees.

I drove a rental car a few months back, a new Ford Focus with the paddle shifters. Naturally I was testing it all out. That's what got my brain thinking a bit.

[214Chevy]

Originally Posted by Flash68

27 to 2 as of now. Who are the 2?

Manual numbers keep growing...

To the OP, Code510, do you have enough votes for the manual to sway your decision yet? I think the "manual" wins hands down.

[GregWeld]

Originally Posted by Tim@TMI

I think you've hit the nail on the head when you talked about trying to find the shifter. That makes perfect sense. With a manual, your hand is always on the shifter, or at least you know where the shifter is at. In the F1 setting it works because lock to lock is only 180 degrees.

I drove a rental car a few months back, a new Ford Focus with the paddle shifters. Naturally I was testing it all out. That's what got my brain thinking a bit.

Egg sack lee.....


If the wheel only turned enough that you never had to take your hands off the wheel -- it would be sweet... but in our street cars -- we're turning A LOT more than that... and there's only two ways to do this -- mount the paddles to the wheel -- and then they're out of position --- or mount to the column -- and then they're out of position.

With the shifter in the console -- and I'm talking paddle shift cars that also have the "automatic" style shifter in the console --- half the cars I've driven you push forward to downshift -- the other half you pull back to downshift... that just confuses the shift out of me! For me - I want to pull back to upshift -- and push to up downshift... but there doesn't seem to be any standard set. So I jump out of one of our cars - and into the other and I'm all messed up!

A stick comes so natural....


Sadly -- Our Audi R8 is the R Tronic trans -- not the new 2014 S Tronic dual clutch. It may get traded in for the new version for no other reason than that.
But even then I've read reviews that complain about slow speed downshifts being "harsh"....

The track at Inde Motorsports where I laid on the R8 had a couple real nasty 1st or 2nd gear corners --- and that's what happened to me -- you'd bang down a shift and BANG is exactly what you got -- damn near jolting the car into oversteer. Upshifts are EASY -- you'd be hard pressed to shift better when you're laying all over it... but downshifting is the "trouble" to me. Downshifting -- you're already busy... yarding off speed getting set for the turn in -- hammering shifts and double clutching and rev matching... looking around the corner for the exit etc -- paying attention to any slippage in the front grip or catching the rear.... I don't need the tranny giving me added things to hunt for.

[intocarss]

To many variables with an automatic transmission and torque converter to make it work as good as a manual trans on a road course. Also an auto trans creates a ton of heat which brings up a whole lot of other issues to make it live..

[Rick D]

One word MANUAL!!!

[Vegas69]

Originally Posted by GregWeld

Egg sack lee.....


If the wheel only turned enough that you never had to take your hands off the wheel -- it would be sweet... but in our street cars -- we're turning A LOT more than that... and there's only two ways to do this -- mount the paddles to the wheel -- and then they're out of position --- or mount to the column -- and then they're out of position.

With the shifter in the console -- and I'm talking paddle shift cars that also have the "automatic" style shifter in the console --- half the cars I've driven you push forward to downshift -- the other half you pull back to downshift... that just confuses the shift out of me! For me - I want to pull back to upshift -- and push to up downshift... but there doesn't seem to be any standard set. So I jump out of one of our cars - and into the other and I'm all messed up!

A stick comes so natural....


Sadly -- Our Audi R8 is the R Tronic trans -- not the new 2014 S Tronic dual clutch. It may get traded in for the new version for no other reason than that.
But even then I've read reviews that complain about slow speed downshifts being "harsh"....

The track at Inde Motorsports where I laid on the R8 had a couple real nasty 1st or 2nd gear corners --- and that's what happened to me -- you'd bang down a shift and BANG is exactly what you got -- damn near jolting the car into oversteer. Upshifts are EASY -- you'd be hard pressed to shift better when you're laying all over it... but downshifting is the "trouble" to me. Downshifting -- you're already busy... yarding off speed getting set for the turn in -- hammering shifts and double clutching and rev matching... looking around the corner for the exit etc -- paying attention to any slippage in the front grip or catching the rear.... I don't need the tranny giving me added things to hunt for.

My S4 has the s tronic dual clutchless and I always thought it was pretty cool. Never raced it.... For autocross, left foot braking, and down shifting, I still think it could be lethal. For real technical road courses and the average driver, I feel the same. But what do I know....