How do you do your gaps and alignment?

[elitecustombody]

Originally Posted by 68protouring454

And no welding solid rod and forming the gap is not butchering anything, its being a craftsmen so when metal finished you cant tell what went on other then the gaps are perfect. The key is to finish both sides not just the outside.
sounds like elite has not done many old cars, the gaps are no where near what new cars are..

Any monkey can weld a rod to edges of panels to fix gaps,and that is the cheater's easy way of fixing things,far from true craftsmanship ,might as well slap some bondo,why bother welding?

Uneven gaps usually means that there is something wrong.There could be old frame damage that was never repaired or half-assed,could be previously damaged body panels with distorted shape, Even if quality control wasn't as strict back then, cars would not leave factory with crooked eneven gaps,they were within certain tolerance .

It's possible the shops that do the rod welding gap adjusting mod simply don't have access to a frame machine

I don't care how old the car is,don't blame that on the age of a car, I've owned and worked on enough cars in last 20 years to know that new car can't leave a factory with gaps so bad ,that the only way to fix them is to weld rods to edges of panels and grind for perfect gap.

[elitecustombody]

Originally Posted by DOOM

So adding rod to the edge is butchering... But if you have to, go head and do it Stefan... Not tring to bust chops here just tring to learn,I know you know what your talking about. But if I tried all that you said and still can't get a proper gap go head and weld the rod to the edge. So go head and butcher it Is'int this a contradiction. Help me understand. I have the same concerns and see alot of the top builders using this method. I also see them splitting the edge and filling the gap to tighten up the gap.Is this better? Have you done this? Butchering my car is the last thing I want to do..

Butchering may be a bit too strong,but it's definitely not proper way.

as I said in the post above, there is no way cars were made that bad,to where there is no adjustment and welding a rod or cutting panel open to add more sheetmetal are the only solutions, it's the cheater's way out ,instead of finding the cause of poor fitment,they resort to quick fix,I'm sure alot of shops/guys won't and don't like what I'm saying,but it's true and it doesn't sit quite well with some of them

obviously that there are many cheap aftermarket sheetmetal parts being used on these cars and that's probably the reason why the parts just don't fit right in the first place, many cars have been in few or more fender-benders in it's 40+ years of existence,many were severly avbused,raced ,e.t.c.,putting alot of stress and causing the body/chassis to twist and buckle, those areas must be found and straightened first before trying to do the rod-welding custom gaps.

I will say, if one is looking for 1/8th inch perfect gaps,then yes, adding material to edges of panels in only few places would be the only way,it it may sound contradicting,but it would be few areas alot less prone to corrosion.Unless you're building one off custom car from scratch,those coachwork metal guys don't use rods to finalize their gaps,it takes true craftsman with alot patience.

[DOOM]

Originally Posted by elitecustombody

Butchering may be a bit too strong,but it's definitely not proper way.

as I said in the post above, there is no way cars were made that bad,to where there is no adjustment and welding a rod or cutting panel open to add more sheetmetal are the only solutions, it's the cheater's way out ,instead of finding the cause of poor fitment,they resort to quick fix,I'm sure alot of shops/guys won't and don't like what I'm saying,but it's true and it doesn't sit quite well with some of them

obviously that there are many cheap aftermarket sheetmetal parts being used on these cars and that's probably the reason why the parts just don't fit right in the first place, many cars have been in few or more fender-benders in it's 40+ years of existence,many were severly avbused,raced ,e.t.c.,putting alot of stress and causing the body/chassis to twist and buckle, those areas must be found and straightened first before trying to do the rod-welding custom gaps.

I will say, if one is looking for 1/8th inch perfect gaps,then yes, adding material to edges of panels in only few places would be the only way,it it may sound contradicting,but it would be few areas alot less prone to corrosion.Unless you're building one off custom car from scratch,those coachwork metal guys don't use rods to finalize their gaps,it takes true craftsman with alot patience.

Thanx Stefan!
I totally understand where your coming from! Like I said I'm just tring to learn..

[68protouring454]

lol. I guess elite is better then me, and all the top shops in the country,dse,troys,kd's,etc. he must know more then all of us on how to align panels.
I am done, if you want advice widow, pm me anytime.
btw- i guess you have not looked at many original camaros, they were far from perfect, its common knowledge that alot of them were 1/2 inch out of square depending on where measured.
jake

[68protouring454]

Originally Posted by The WidowMaker

jake, are you actually splitting the panel and widening the gap, or are you adding a vertical piece and then filling it in?

no, a common issue with goodmark trunks is there too small for the hole width wise. the gaps were arounf 7/16ths. we sliced the quarter 1/16th from edge, moved over till we had 3/16ths strong gap and measured, then used shear to shear filler piece that we but tig welded in using silicon bronze. metal finished to 80 grit and body worked.
goodluck

[68protouring454]

so elite, tell us. if you need a deck lid and buy a goodmark one and it has almost 1/2 gaps on each side, how do you make it fit correct? or how about a goodmark hood which commonly has good side gaps but almost always tapered gap on the front against the header panel, one side of middle is good other is wide, what is out of shape then? i guess no aftermarket panel company would make something that out of tolerance? please let us all in on how to adjust quarter panels to make the trunk lid fit.

ps- maybe i should go drag some pics off dse's website, troys website of panel aligment and welding, etc. I forgot they are monkeys as well

[TravisB]

Originally Posted by 68protouring454

so elite, tell us. if you need a deck lid and buy a goodmark one and it has almost 1/2 gaps on each side, how do you make it fit correct? or how about a goodmark hood which commonly has good side gaps but almost always tapered gap on the front against the header panel, one side of middle is good other is wide, what is out of shape then? i guess no aftermarket panel company would make something that out of tolerance? please let us all in on how to adjust quarter panels to make the trunk lid fit.

Jake you haven't heard anytime a gap is to wide you put the car on the frame machine and tighten her up....you know just pull the rear rails together tap it with a a body hammer, pick it with a PDR tool do some adjusting and thats that....

We weld edges, split panels, anything we have to do to make gaps perfect as long as the panel isnt warped and its metal finished there is no way to tell one way from the other.....

there is NO car that camed from the factory I have ever seen with 3/16 gaps as most of the new OE's have and im gonna say the car with the metal finshed welded gaps blows the car with the metal massaged (non-butchered) technique away panel fit wise...

[elitecustombody]

Originally Posted by 68protouring454

so elite, tell us. if you need a deck lid and buy a goodmark one and it has almost 1/2 gaps on each side, how do you make it fit correct? or how about a goodmark hood which commonly has good side gaps but almost always tapered gap on the front against the header panel, one side of middle is good other is wide, what is out of shape then? i guess no aftermarket panel company would make something that out of tolerance? please let us all in on how to adjust quarter panels to make the trunk lid fit.

ps- maybe i should go drag some pics off dse's website, troys website of panel aligment and welding, etc. I forgot they are monkeys as well

somebody got their panties in a wad? stop buying poor fitting parts and most of your fitting problems will go away.

just because everyone is doing it doesn't make it right.

I'll say it again, any monkey can weld rods to tighten up gaps,but it takes a real craftsman to line and massage panels for perfect fit,

read my previous posts CLOSER and maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from

[68protouring454]

I am all good buddy. it obvious you have never done a first gen camaro or old (pre 73) car period. Guess I should just go to gm to buy my deck lids and hoods from now on.
btw- it takes a real metal man to take what oem built and make it better,ie adding metal, blocking over panel gaps etc.

[TravisB]

Originally Posted by elitecustombody

somebody got their panties in a wad? stop buying poor fitting parts and most of your fitting problems will go away.

just because everyone is doing it doesn't make it right.

I'll say it again, any monkey can weld rods to tighten up gaps,but it takes a real craftsman to line and massage panels for perfect fit,

read my previous posts CLOSER and maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from

I think you and your 280 posts are out numbered here unfortunalty..... that or you're the only craftsmen out of all the car builders I know... maybe you should have your own tv show... all hail king of the pdr tool panel fit man